Can You Back the Troops and Oppose War?

The Weekly Standard ^ | 04/02/2003 6:20:00 AM | Terry Eastland

[AbsoluteJustice]

OMG SPEC!!!!!!
Haven't seen you for ages...LOL

[KantianBurke]

What were conservatives saying about our troops during Clintoon's Kosovo adventure or "Operation Desert Fox aka get impeachment out of the headlines?"

[AbsoluteJustice]

What are you asking on this?? I would like to respond to it.

[richardtavor]

How many more Iraqis would die if we hadn't gone there (or Afghanistan?) Wedidn'tgo to Rwanda either, and "only" 800,000 died. We can stay out of every conflict and avoid U.S. casualties (until they come here.) Certainly, we are not the policemen of the world, but to knowingly allow slaughter when we could do something about it, seems morally repugnant. Could Hussein give WMD's to terrorist that could attack us directly? Who knows. I personally am concerned with these dictators that slaughter thousands (or millions) with no worry about retribution (it is obvious that the UN has never held anyone responsible for mass murder.) Therefore, I believe that the belief of these tyrants that the US and its allies will hold them responsible is actually a deterrent. And yes, I did serve in the military during time of war and understand the trepidations of the morality of battle.

[Sloth]

That sign doesn't really exist. I know, because Janeane Garofalo said so.

[Zavien Doombringer]

Murder is the act of killing with a selfish motive

mur·der (mûrdr) n. The unlawful killing of one human by another, especially with premeditated malice. Slang. Something that is very uncomfortable, difficult, or hazardous: The rush hour traffic is murder. A flock of crows. See Synonyms at flock1. v. mur·dered, mur·der·ing, mur·ders v. tr. To kill (another human) unlawfully. To kill brutally or inhumanly. To put an end to; destroy: murdered their chances. To spoil by ineptness; mutilate: a speech that murdered the English language. Slang. To defeat decisively; trounce. v. intr. To commit murder. Idioms: get away with murder Informal To escape punishment for or detection of an egregiously blameworthy act. murder will out Secrets or misdeeds will eventually be disclosed.

Killing in defence for self or others isn't murder;

kill (kl) v. killed, kill·ing, kills v. tr. To put to death. To deprive of life: The Black Death was a disease that killed millions. To put an end to; extinguish: The rain killed our plans for a picnic. To destroy a vitally essential quality in: Too much garlic killed the taste of the meat. To cause to cease operating; turn off: killed the motor. To tire out completely; exhaust: “The trip to work, and the boredom and nervousness of jobs, kills men” (Jimmy Breslin). To pass (time) in aimless activity: killed a few hours before the flight by sightseeing. To consume entirely; finish off: kill a bottle of brandy. Sports. To prevent a hockey team on a power play from scoring during (a penalty). To cause extreme pain or discomfort to: My shoes are killing me. To mark for deletion; rule out: killed the story. To thwart passage of; veto: kill a congressional bill. Informal. To overwhelm with hilarity, pleasure, or admiration: The outstanding finale killed the audience. Sports. To hit (a ball) with great force. To hit (a ball) with such force as to make a return impossible, especially in a racquet game. v. intr. To cause death or extinction; be fatal. To commit(in the act of) murder. Informal. To make such a strong impression as to overcome: dress to kill. n. The act of killing. An animal killed, especially in hunting. A person killed or to be killed: “Infantrymen... had seen too many kills suddenly get up and run away or shoot at them as they approached” (Nelson DeMille). An enemy aircraft, vessel, or missile that has been attacked and destroyed. Sports. A kill shot. Phrasal Verb: kill off To destroy in such large numbers as to render extinct.

Our service members are not murdering anyone, Saddam Hussien commited murder already...

[finnman69]

Can you support firemen but oppose them putting our fires?

Can you support policemen but oppose them catching criminals?

Can you support doctors but oppose them curing diseases?

Can you suport teachers but oppose them teaching students?


Supporting the troops and opposing the war is a very weak copout lie.

[Chancellor Palpatine]

No, you can't. It is an inconsistency, and an utter lie.

[Chancellor Palpatine]

This thread has become an exercise in disingenuous and fake sincerity from our "friends" of the paleocon left.

[TracyPA]

I don't think most troops oppose war. We have a volunteer military. In the back of their minds the troops knew they would eventually have to fight sometime. If a person is a true pacifist (opposed to the use of force under any circumstance) why on earth would they join the military!!! If we still had the draft you might have a point.

[mr.pink]

Mr.Pink ... please explain how you can support troops that are carrying out a mission that you believe to be immoral, illegal, or for whatever reason you oppose the mission?

Okay.

My brother, who is absolutely against this war is currently on his third trip overseas to deliver tanks and armor to our troops.

He should be enjoying a four month vacation, but was called to make this voyage. Is he, while firmly against the war, not supporting the troops?

[Lost Highway]

Most troops oppose war.

Source please.

[KantianBurke]

I'm trying to demonstrate how it can be logically permissable to be for the troops and yet be opposed to the mission they have been assigned. Conservatives obviously didn't come to hate US troops during Kosovo but certainly objected to Clinton's actions. Let's be consistent and acknowledge that.

[Sid Rich]

And you bring sincerity and honesty to the table?!

[MortMan]

I think there's a VERY fine line.

If a person stated before the war that it (the war) was wrong, that diplomacy or the UN or whatever was a better route to take, etc., that was fine. If this same person, after the commencement of hostilities stops bad-mouthing the CINC's decisions, openly embraces our troops, and shuts up about the pre-war issues (because they're moot), they can be said to oppose the war and still support the troops.

JMO A more accurate way to state the dichotomy and hypocrisy is this: Nobody can protest the war during the fighting and still claim to support the troops - that is rank hypocrisy.

[BlueLancer]

I completely agree with you ... my examples may have been off-the-mark, but my question to Mr.Pink was questioning his ability to "back the troops but oppose the war".

Sorry for the inartful language.

[stuartcr]

Many join the military for the education/benefits, but never want to go to war.

[Poohbah]

What if a soldier is opposed to the very action he/she is carrying out?

He should be dishonorably discharged.

Not necessarily true.

Many men have honorably served in wars that they disagreed with.

When a Marine is given an order he is opposed to, the proper course of action for that Marine is a smart "Aye aye, sir," followed by the Marine carrying out the order to the best of his ability.

As Patton said "I won't have a yellow bastard in my army."

Separate issue. There is no room for cowardice in the armed forces.

However, there is plenty of room for individuals whose prudential judgement leads them to believe that a specific military campaign or battle is ill-advised, but who will remain true to their oath of enlistment or commissioning and faithfully carry out the orders of the Commander-in-Chief.

[Leatherneck_MT]

Amen

[Egregious Philbin]

No, you can't. It is an inconsistency, and an utter lie.

So I should support the troops AND the war for... the sake of not being inconsistent? THAT would be a lie - my opposition to the war is based on extensive reading and newswatching. I really believe that it will not make us safer. I oppose the war yet hope we win. If I oppose the war AND hope we lose, THEN I would not be supporting the troops. I will not lie and say I think the war is a good idea, nor will I put aside my desire to see my friends and relatives in the military return safely.