Mel Gibson's unholy Sunday

PAGE SIX - New York Post ^ | 3/06/03 | RICHARD JOHNSON with PAULA FROELICH and CHRIS WILSON

[kattracks]

MEL Gibson is furious at the New York Times over a story that will depict him as a pope-hating, conspiracy-minded cultist.

Gibson went on Bill O'Reilly's show in January claiming reporter Christopher Noxon was doing a "hit piece" on him and "digging into [his] private life . . . getting into [his] banking affairs . . . harassing [his] family, including my 85-year-old father."

[Robert Drobot]

Can't wait to see the movie!!! Another 100 Gibsons' in Hollywood would clean up that town.

[dasboot]

"From then on, Pilate tried to set Jesus free, but the Jews kept shouting, "If you let this man go, you are no friend of Caesar....."

Josephus, Mark, Luke , John, and Matthew are unanimous on the point.

I'd be interested to know the source of your assertion; I'm always open to learning something new.

[Straight Vermonter]

Getting angry is a normal human emotion, and neither Christian nor unChristian, in my view. It is what we do about our anger that reveals whether we are Christian or not.

Right you are! I am so tired of Christians being told by non-Christians what hey are supposed to be. Not being angry at injustice would not make you Christian it would make you stupid.

[Terridan]

As would I... I love Mel Gibson, just cuz he is normal, a family man, and makes great movies! My family will not only see the movie, but we will purchase it as well. I hate that I missed him on the O'Reily the whinner show!

[William McKinley]

Who killed Jesus?

Man.

But if we have to try to limit it to a certain ethnicity, several were complicit, with the Romans probably the most so. Yet certain groups of people seem to want to ignore them and instead blame another group, the Jews.

Why do you think that is?

[SkyPilot]

Here is my feeling....

We all killed Him, because all of us are sinners.

As for Gibson, I love the guy. He is courageous, conservative, a family man, and makes great movies..........

....no wonder they are gunning for him.

[William McKinley]

Exactly. As I said, man killed him.

[elephantlips]

It's not just your view Judith Anne, the Bible is replete with episodes of God's anger and we are made in His image. That does not in itself condone anger but as Judith Anne has said, it's neither Christian or unChristian.

[Richard Kimball]

No then who did it ?

We did.

[dasboot]

The historical record (to which I have access) seems to run athwart your assertion. It's pretty clear that the civil administrator would rather have released Jesus, but the Jewish temple priests and the largest part of the assembled crowd forced Pilate's hand. Obviously that record also indicates that Jesus had followers both Jew and Gentile; and disregarding the Gospels as suspect (as you may be inclined) Josephus, acknowledged to be reliable, places the blame squarely upon the Jews, his own brethren. He goes to no great pains to make the point, and mentions it in a passing, common knowledge way. Why is it comforting to disregard the plain truth of the thing? The event took place 2000 years ago; the participants are dead.

No reasonable person could hold the posterity of Jews 2000 years ago somehow guilty of those ancient doings. Or is this revision an accomodation for unreasonable people? To assuage unreasonable sentimants?

[William McKinley]

Oh I see.

The administrator, who had the final say, is assuaged of primary guilt because he gave in to pressure.

That is a strage way of looking at things. I suppose that if a mob is yelling for someone to pull the trigger, a person could shoot someone and not be guilty.

They made me do it is a weak excuse.

The fact of the matter is that the sins of mankind are for what Jesus died. We all killed him. He died for all of us.

[dasboot]

As a matter of metephysical consideration, I understand, and agree with , your assessment.

[Mat_Helm]

What a silly arguement. No man in history has had such an impact on mankind as the short life of Christ on earth when God walked the planet as a man. There is no arguement that it was the Jews who had Christ put to death and that the Romans nailed Him to the cross. Noxon is way of base if he is attempting to imply that the Jews did the actual physical crucifiction or that this was ever a medevil myth. He is equaly wrong to indicate that it is a midevil myth that the Jews had Christ crucified. It has always been the belief of the Church that the Jews rejected Christ and were responsible for His death. The rulers of Christian nations often pursecuted Jews for this reason such as Spain and Portugal and Italy, though they were misguided in singling out the Jewish poeple. As others have stated it was man as a whole and our sin that is ultimately responsible for Chist's death as predicted by the prophets. The early Church treated the old faith as anti-christ because the Jews still denied that Jesus is God. The Pope recently put an end to this centuries old arguement that the Jews have no salvation buy reinforcing the fact that the Jews wait for the same messiah that Christians do. For Christians it will be the second coming and for the Jews the same Lord coming for the same reasons, to save his people and all the world from destruction and for the salvation of all mankind.

Noxon is a moron and knows little about faith and should not attempt to write about what he doesn't understand. Jesus was betrayed by Judas, condemned by Ciaphas and Herod, judged by Pilot who found no guilt but followed the law and wishes of the Jewish politicians, crucified by the Romans, and raised by God to sit at His right hand and judge all mankind in the end.

[dasboot]

Roger that.

[rmlew]

Are you saying that the crowd calling for the release of the thief was Greek, Italian, and Gaul?

No account of this was written at the time. The Gospel of John was written 60 years after Jesus was put to death, at a time when Christian were distancing themselves from Jews.
You cannot ignore the politics of the time. The Jews were very restless under Roman rule and Hellenistic colonization. In 66 they revolted. The Great Revolt Was put down. Christians, who had been a Jewish sect untill then, distanced themselves from Jews. They preached unto the Romans and Hellenistic settelers. Thus there was a real interest in laying blam upon the "Jews".

[dasboot]

Josephus was born at about the time of Jesus' murder. He joined the Pharisees at age nineteen. He was also among the revolting Jews from which you claim the Christians distanced themselves.

I refer you to his written statement above.

[rmlew]

Please see my response to 19. You can't ignore the Politics.
Josephus was a sell-out to the Romans who survived after 66 by fighting with them. Moreover, no origional work of his survives. Rather we deal with later copies edited by the Roman and then christian authorities.

Here are some balanced accounts.
Who killed Jesus?
http://www.straightdope.com/mailbag/mjesuskill.html

http://www.sullivan-county.com/id2/jews_killed.htm

Biased accounts, but still useful
http://www.faqs.org/faqs/judaism/FAQ/09-Antisemitism/section-10.html

[dasboot]

Thanks for the links and info. I'll explore.

[dasboot]

Very interesting stuff! Thanks again!

[rmlew]

Please understand. I'm not trying to attack Christianity.
I am simply trying to show a reason for the inequitable blame being put on Jews.