Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

To: SoothingDave
You can't be that dumb

I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and say you can't be dumb enough to believe that the Vatican is a real, legitimate sovereign political state. I'll give it a test. Say a renegade band of Moslems storm Vatican City and take it over. Do the citizens of this so-called sovereign state call out their Army, Marines and Air Force to take back their nation or do the call a real sovereign state, like Italy to do it for them. I think we both know the answer to this one.

Bush has to listen to them because of internal US politics (wanting votes of all those RC sheep), not because they are in any sense a legitimate "country".

The reason I used the Elvis example is because his empire (Graceland) is based on the same religious zeal as your Vatican City and has the same legitimacy of "sovereign state". The real difference is that Graceland is based purely on greed and not a power-grab, so they haven't needed to declare itself an independent state. (Note, this does not mean that the Elvis religion is equal in truth to your RC church, but is equal in legitimacy as a real state.)

147 posted on 03/05/2003 4:18:29 PM PST by Iowegian
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 136 | View Replies ]


To: Iowegian
I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and say you can't be dumb enough to believe that the Vatican is a real, legitimate sovereign political state.

I'm a lot dumber than you think. So, apparently, are many countries in the world and the US. As are the foolish folks in the Italian mint, who make Euro coins for the Vatican, distinct from the Italian or French or German coins. Likewise, the idiots who enter the Vatican and get their passports stamped.

There's this thing, this treaty, between Italy and the Vatican that does indeed give sovereignity over the Vatican City sate to the Pope. It is an established fact. Only a red-blooded bigot would fail to see this fact.

I'll give it a test. Say a renegade band of Moslems storm Vatican City and take it over. Do the citizens of this so-called sovereign state call out their Army, Marines and Air Force to take back their nation or do the call a real sovereign state, like Italy to do it for them. I think we both know the answer to this one.

So, a state, in order to be "real" must have an army. Is that your contention? I thought a state, to be sovereign, had to have sovereignity. Silly me.

For what it's worth, the Vatican does indeed have security forces prepared to handle affairs for a state of its size. It is not like the Pope needs to project his force with bullets into the world.

And, also, in your example, the Vatican City state happens to be within the territory of the state of Italy. A Moslem invasion force would need to first occupy parts of Italy in order to attack the Vatican. So it would be a concern of Itay's as well.

I also recall a much larger sovereign state calling in help from the US and the world when it was run over. What was it? Oh, yeah, Kuwait. Is Kuwait not sufficiently military to meet your criteria as well? What of Luxembourg or Lichtenstein?

Also, as much animosity as there was in the past, Italy and the Vatican do cooperate to a much larger extent than, say, an ignorant American fundamentalist would like.

SD

148 posted on 03/06/2003 6:59:55 AM PST by SoothingDave
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 147 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson