Snubbing Turkey--State Department missteps played a part in Saturday’s embarrassing vote.

National Review ^ | 3-3-03 | Joel Mowbray

[UncleSamUSA]

Yikes, we have just heard from a "peace loving" jackass from the State Department.

The sad fact is that EVERYTHING I posted in my original post is correct and documented fact. The problem is that State Department apologists like you can't stand to face the truth of public disclosure.

[etcetera]

I followed your posts last night. Looks like your anger is somewhat justified. The media and our State Dept screwed around and made Turkey look bad. Americans shouldn't forget that half the Turkish parliament voted for us, even though the war is unpopular with the Turkish people.

Thanks for your (and your government's) support. I know this will all work out in the end. Turkey and the U.S. will continue to be good friends and allies.

If you get interesting articles from Turkish media, please post them (in Turkish) and include your translation below it. I know many Freepers would welcome the info. I look forward to your future posts on FR.

[DeuceTraveler]

"We have to stop thinking our enemies will ever be our allies"



I disagree. We have plenty of support in the Muslim world, more than I would have thought we had a year ago. The Muslim world consists of more countries than Saudi, Iran, and Iraq. Whoever was handling the politics screwed big time in Turkey.

[DeuceTraveler]

"Asinine, this whole thing. Someone is trying to screw both of us... "



I agree. This reveals a part of the war that the US currently wages. And I am not talking about the US against fundamentalism. This is an internal, intellectual civil war being waged by our Socialist Democrats headed by men such as Bill Clinton against the Republican right. It's not just a war over politics, it is a war being waged for the very minds and souls of the American people.

[paul51]

We have plenty of support in the Muslim world

Sure we do. The truth of the matter is our so called allies such as Turkey, France and Germany are generally anti American with interest that are opposed to ours. The only time they are 'our allies' is when they want something from us. As far as Muslims as allies.....please, don't get me started.

[DeuceTraveler]

"Rush is talking about this article right now."



: ) I love being part of the Conservative Right. It feels good to be this well networked.

[a_Turk]

Nothing hurts more than hearing the people who are supposed to be my allies suggest that my nation, my parents should be bombed...

[Miss Marple]

You should know by now that we have large groups of hotheads who just like to post stuff like that. Ignore them.

It seems to me that someone has a vested interest in stirring up trouble between Turkey and the USA. Why did the press spend so much energy making it seem like this argument was solely about money? Why is Saddam congratulating Turkey? I am very interested in who has been causing trouble and what their motives are.

[DeuceTraveler]

"You aren't falling for this baloney are you? State is not undermining anything. The relationship between the DoD and the Turkish military is much easier to obtain that any with the party of nuts which is taking over the government.

There is no split here."


I trust the Turks further than I trust Clinton holdovers in the State Department. Our Department of State has continually been a problem ever since Bush came into office.

[Just mythoughts]

So correct, what I also saw interesting is the fact that so many here don't see a big picture and personally, rather than allow the Turkey vote become the issue, the Pentagon had stated a while back they had alternative plans.

Basically, move on and if that is what is then accept it.

SO no I do not blame the vote, I don't like it don't agree with it but understand fully after watching CNN and its mis-information for years.

Do not want it to become the issue, another track like N. Korea to pull away from the target. I also don't want the US be pictured as a beggar, bully, and portrayed as buying friends, instead of paying for usage of land, space of the nation, a clean straight up contract with no hidden agenda like the "LEFTIST" do.

[Miss Marple]

Ah-ha! Over on the live Estrada debate thread, Senator Harkin has started criticizing our relations with Turkey, and saying that Turkey was right to turn us down. (Because Harkin is against anything Bush does, not because he actually knows anything about Turkish politics). Harkin, who is a true Clinton supporter, is trying to portray this as a blemish on the Bush administration and proof we shouldn't go into Iraq.

Now who would have had an interest in dissension between allies? I am going to check and see if all of those Rat senators start in about Turkey. If it is one of their talking points for the day, we can figure that they have some operatives in the State Department who gave them a heads up.

[colorado tanker]

That's probably salvagable without actually having a pouring out of LUV and coming to a full alliance sort of partnership agreement.

Actually, I wouldn't rule that out, depending on how badly Franks and Rumsfeld want a northern front. That division worth of equipment floating off the Turkish coast will be pretty useless without one.

I would echo the pro-Turk opinions on this thread. Conservatives who have followed this know how important Turkey has been as a US ally in NATO and the defacto US/Turkey/Israel alliance.

[a_Turk]

The US press has consistently bad mouthed Turkey for as long as I can remember.

The US has allowed the Kurdish terror organization, the PKK, to organize on American soil up to a few days after 9/11.

The PKK was conducting a propaganda campaign from a tent across from the Turkish embassy in DC for over a year.

The US congress has blocked helicopter sales to Turkey claiming that Turkey would use those against her civilian population.

When NATO contribution to the Turkish military fell below 30 million dollars a year about 10 years ago, the Turkish administration said: "You know what? Just keep it."

There was a governor who in a speach praised Ataturk, but had to apologize later because of pressure from the Greek and Armenian diaspora in the US.

Your external affairs vs Turkey have been hijacked by said diaspora. No matter what their claims regarding the past, where US national security is concerned, cool heads must prevail.

This has been going on for ever.

When Murad Topalian was busted in Cleveland with explosives and weapons he kept in storage, and when it was further discovered that he was complicit in the Turkish consulate bombing in NYC, where Americans were also hurt, he received 2.5 years in low security jail.......

The Turkish Consulate in NYC has been encircled with freeway dividers.. Why is that?

The trouble here runs deep. Very deep.

It reminds me of Ottoman history, where the state had been hijacked by beurocrat operatives on external payrolls. It ended in a disaster.

[Just mythoughts]

Well considering that CNN was specifically mentioned as calling the Turks as blackmailers, one would not need to go to the State Dept., nice place to blame, but look who works for CNN and their senate connections.

Not saying it wasn't State Dept., but who better and easier to blame since State Dept., is such a usual suspect of the conservatives.

[Miss Marple]

There was an interesting resignation letter from a career State Department guy printed in the New York Times, to cause maximum embarassment. He happened to be stationed at the Greek Embassy, and was griping that Powell was too loyal to the President. Your discussion reminds me of that.

If one good thing comes from this mess, it will be that Americans need to pay more attention to foreign affairs, day in and out, and not leave it in the hands of the career diplomats and the politicians.

[a_Turk]

If anybody wants on or off my list, now's a good time to let me know..

[a_Turk]

Can you post that here? Please?

[ClancyJ]

First we hear rumors that Bush is furious that the CIA did not coordinate the anti forces on the ground in Iraq. Now we hear that the State Department totally went against political practices and left Turkey out of the planning group brining in other outside forces.

I feel we are seeing more of the forces we are now working against in play - the liberals seeking to undercut Bush on any possible front and prevent his re-election, the anti-war groups that don't want funds spent on war, and the duplicity of France, Germany and Russia over their under-the-table dealings with Iraq.

Time for Bush to pull the plug on them. Back off and deal with only the departments that are trustworthy. Cut off the State Department. Powell got us into this mess with the U.N. greatly damaging our world image and hindering the protection of Americans. He then fails to monitor the negotiations of his own department resulting in possible harm to our troops.

There should be high level meetings in the White House over this nonsense.

Another thing - there should never have been ships sitting out there waiting on a decision by Turkey. This should have been resolved long ago. Yet, it appears the forces at play want to embarrass Bush and make America look like fools.

[a_Turk]

It's a real tear-jerker.

[a_Turk]

bump