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Three mystery ships are tracked over suspected 'weapons' cargo
independent.co.uk ^ | 2/19/03

Posted on 02/18/2003 4:47:00 PM PST by knak

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To: FairOpinion
. And if they know of three ships, there may be others.

I read earlier today - on FR, but I don't remember the post, unfortunately - that there are way more than three. Perhaps these three are the biggest and possibly most dangerous and most connected to Iraq, but there are several others, which have been scattered across the seas for several months now. I think some of them are believed to belong directly to Al Qaeda.

41 posted on 02/18/2003 5:15:37 PM PST by livius
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To: knak
Darn!
Aren't there areas of the oceans where ships are known to disappear without a trace?

Wait.
Are we even sure these ships exist?
Hmmmmmmmmmmm.

42 posted on 02/18/2003 5:16:11 PM PST by Publius6961 (p>)
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Comment #43 Removed by Moderator

To: knak
...spent much of their time in the deep waters of the Indian Ocean, berthing at sea when they need to collect supplies of fuel and food. They have berthed in a handful of Arab countries, including Yemen.

What exactly, is "berthing at sea?" Either you tie up or you don't. Are they coming close to a harbor and requesting supplies? Are these Arab countrues (Yemen) ferrying stuff out to them?

If this story is true as reported, the good news is that we know their precise lat and long every minute of every day. And we can take care of them as needed. This is a perfect target for a tacticical nuke. We have to kill the biologicals and obliterate the chemicals, don't we?

44 posted on 02/18/2003 5:17:50 PM PST by Semper911 (I used to have another tagline. This is my new one.)
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To: knak
Bloop! What's that sound? Oh, the sound of WMD's being tossed over board because of gross negligence by the "authoritative shipping industry sources" and the Independent. They just tipped the scum off. Thanks a lot guy's!!!!!!!!!!!!!
45 posted on 02/18/2003 5:18:27 PM PST by Nexus (I hope we started boarding an hour ago...)
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To: Cicero
Intentional leak...
count on it.

We are telegraphing once again to SEVERAL WORLD powers that we KNOW where they are at all times and exactly what they are doing...

KIM JONG, RUSSIA AND CHINA... espcially.
This is the equivalent of a shot across the bow... and count on the fact that there will be more of such... and soon.

They laugh and say, "The Americans only know of three?" When we all know that Al Quada related businesses had at one point upwards of three hundred such vessels (purchased from russia and china's cosco?).

The game is afoot. Sit back and have a beer.
btw... nice screen name.
46 posted on 02/18/2003 5:19:43 PM PST by Robert_Paulson2 (clintonsgotusbytheballs?)
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To: KEYSTONE
73 Iraqis sailed out to history.....
47 posted on 02/18/2003 5:19:47 PM PST by tet68 (Jeremiah 51:24 ..."..Before your eyes I will repay Babylon for all the wrong they have done in Zion")
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To: mountaineer
that was funny.
48 posted on 02/18/2003 5:20:05 PM PST by Robert_Paulson2 (clintonsgotusbytheballs?)
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To: livius
"I think some of them are believed to belong directly to Al Qaeda."

Yup. I believe I read there were 15 Al-Qa'ida ships.

Couldn't chemical/bio laden scuds launched from freighters into Washington, etc, cause a lot of havoc.

49 posted on 02/18/2003 5:20:30 PM PST by blam
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To: FairOpinion
You give us humans too much capability. The Indian or any other ocean is more than up to to the job of handling anything on those ships. A few pounds or a few hundred pounds of fissionable material would be nothing to an Ocean. How many nuclear subs have gone down? If the thing was filled to the brim with anthax, or VX or anything, it would amount to next to nothing in a ocean, maybe 1 part per quadillion. I laughed when I read it. What's up - who know?
50 posted on 02/18/2003 5:21:34 PM PST by TheHound
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To: tet68
"Ride Captain, ride, upon your mystery ship......."

Good one!   Thank you, now that stupid Gilligan's Island song has been bumped from my head.
51 posted on 02/18/2003 5:22:40 PM PST by GirlShortstop
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To: knak
This sounds stupid.

Why not search them? The fear of scuttle is rediculous...the threat to Human existence these weapons pose far outweighs any environmental considerations and the US Navy SEALS train to board ships with tactics designed to specifically prevent them from being scuttled.

Why release this information? You're setting yourself up for international ridicule if they dont have any weapons aboard.

This sound like a cheesy-Liberal setup piece.
52 posted on 02/18/2003 5:23:52 PM PST by VaBthang4 (tm)
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To: knak
Here's a more interesting question. How come our multi-billion dollar intelligence infrastructure didn't pick up the loading of the ships in port? Once again, mediocre people have let us down.
53 posted on 02/18/2003 5:24:04 PM PST by Archangelsk
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To: knak
- "SHIPPING ROLE IN AL QAEDA TERRORISM — ‘15 FREIGHTERS IDENTIFIED," CILT News (from the Chartered Institute of Logistics and Transport) 1 January 2003 , http://www.citrans.org.uk/news-display.asp?ID=36.

Concerned about the vulnerabilities of American shipping since Sept. 11, 2001, U.S. officials have started paying more attention than ever to what cargo is loaded onto ships entering U.S. waters, and to who serves on crews, as well as to stowaways and individuals who appear to be surveying U.S. ports, reports The Washington Post.

In addition, U.S. intelligence agencies have set up large databases to track cargo, ships and seamen in a search for "anomalies" that could indicate terrorists on approaching ships, said Frances Fragos-Townsend, chief of U.S. Coast Guard intelligence.

The U.S. has identified approximately 15 cargo freighters around the world that they believe are controlled by al Qaeda or could be used by the terrorist network to ferry operatives, bombs, money or commodities over the high seas, government officials said.

Osama bin Laden, al Qaeda's leader and his aides have owned ships for years, some of which transported such commodities as cement and sesame seeds. But one vessel delivered the explosives that al Qaeda operatives used to bomb two U.S. embassies in Africa in 1998, U.S. officials said.

Since September 2001, the U.S. list of al Qaeda mystery ships has varied from a low of a dozen to a high of 50. Some are ships up to 400 feet long that do not need to refuel on extended journeys, and therefore are less likely to draw scrutiny. U.S. officials do not know precisely how each of these "ships of concern" is being used, except that some are generating profits for al Qaeda. Any of them could be used in an attack anywhere in the world, officials fear. The Washington Post quoted terrorism experts as saying that Al Qaeda has escalated its attempts to launch assaults at sea because it believes waterborne targets are easier, Starting with the suicide bombing of the USS Cole off Yemen in 2000, by al Qaeda men in an inflatable dinghy — a strike that killed 17 sailors — U.S. officials have discerned a steady increase in nautical attacks, some of which were aborted by the planners or uncovered by authorities at the last moment. The latest attack came in October, when the hull of the French oil tanker Limburg was blasted by a speedboat off Yemen, causing a widespread oil spill.

"A shadowy underworld"

For decades, U.S. intelligence focused on foreign shipping only sporadically but after Sept. 11, U.S. officials realised the danger of terrorists attacking from the sea, and rushed to gain expertise about the world's commercial shipping industry.

U.S. Navy intelligence has struck data-sharing agreements with dozens of allied navies, and enlisted tipsters among port managers across the globe, as well as shipping agents, crew manning supervisors and seafarers unions.

"This industry is a shadowy underworld," said a senior U.S. government official knowledgeable about the effort. "After 9/11, we suddenly learned how little we understood about commercial shipping. You can't swing a dead cat in the shipping business without hitting somebody with phoney papers."

Dozens of Navy and allied ships are scouring the Arabian Sea in search of al Qaeda ships and fighters, in one of the largest naval seahunts since World War II. Members have searched hundreds of ships, and issued hundreds more "challenges" by radio asking for information.

In that part of the world, U.S. naval officers suspect they are as likely to find terrorists aboard a 300-foot freighter as they are aboard a dhow, the small sailing vessel common along the coasts of the Indian Ocean. U.S. officials believe traders sailing small craft have been bribed for months to help al Qaeda fighters escape from Pakistan to Yemen and other countries.

U.S. efforts to track al Qaeda's activities at sea received a boost last month with the capture of Abd al-Rahim al-Nashiri, an alleged mastermind of al Qaeda's nautical strategy who officials say is now co-operating with U.S. interrogators.

'Flags' of Convenience

Another new preoccupation for U.S. intelligence is the thousands of merchant ships world-wide that are registered in "flag of convenience" nations, some of which ask for almost no information from shipping firms that "flag" their vessels with them.

Navy officials say al Qaeda has used one shipping fleet — called Nova and incorporated in Delaware, U.S., and Romania but which is flagged in the Pacific island of Tonga — to transport operatives around the Mediterranean Sea. Last February, eight Pakistani men jumped ship off one of its freighters, the Twillinger, at the Italian port of Trieste after a trip from Cairo. U.S. officials say they determined that the men — who lied about being crewmen and carried false documents and large sums of money — had been sent by al Qaeda.

In August, after the captain of another of Nova's freighters, the recently renamed Sara, radioed to maritime authorities in Italy, U.S. officials say they found tens of thousands of dollars, false documents, maps of Italian cities and evidence tying some of those on board to al Qaeda members in Europe, and concluded that they, too, were possibly on a terrorist mission.

In October, European navies set up a dragnet for another Nova freighter, the oft-renamed Cristi. Greek merchant marine minister George Anomeritis told reporters then that besides the Cristi, NATO also has been looking for 24 other ships suspected of terrorist ties.

** The European Union has started legal action against member states who have bilateral anti-terrorist deals with the United States to beef up port security for U.S.-bound cargo, officials said.

The EU's executive Commission said all 15 member nations should join together in negotiating an overall deal with Washington, a move it claims would increase security and eliminate trade discrimination between EU ports.

Since Sept. 11, 2001, EU-U.S. co-operation has increased sharply, though disputes over the extradition of suspects and information sharing remain.

So far the United States has closed deals with the world's busiest port, Rotterdam in the Netherlands, as well as Belgium's Antwerp, Hamburg and Bremerhaven in Germany and the port at Le Havre in France.

Smaller EU ports are concerned being left out will leave them with a competitive disadvantage because cargo from the big ports would be given faster clearance in U.S. ports.

54 posted on 02/18/2003 5:25:06 PM PST by piasa (Attitude adjustments offered here free of charge.)
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To: tet68
Maybe that's where the 'disappeared' Pakastani nuclear scientists that Ijaz Mansoor mentioned have gone...to sea. I think he said 19 are missing.

Manhattan Project at sea?

55 posted on 02/18/2003 5:25:07 PM PST by blam
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To: knak
Do they really think we won't notice three ships?
56 posted on 02/18/2003 5:25:38 PM PST by ItisaReligionofPeace ((the original))
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To: blam
Couldn't chemical/bio laden scuds launched from freighters into Washington, etc, cause a lot of havoc.

Yes, and considering a bunch of Haitian refugees just tooted on in under the Rickenbacker causeway a couple of months ago (in a leaky boat mind you), I seriously doubt any waterway is secure.

57 posted on 02/18/2003 5:26:44 PM PST by Archangelsk
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To: NorseWood
Conn - Sonar - tracking contacts Sierra One, Sierra Two and Sierra Three. All fish are running hot, straight and normal.
58 posted on 02/18/2003 5:26:48 PM PST by Jambe
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To: GirlShortstop

59 posted on 02/18/2003 5:27:05 PM PST by Lunatic Fringe
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Comment #60 Removed by Moderator


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