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To: Non-Sequitur
"I've yet to hear one word of criticizm from you about Jefferson Davis, his terrible racist beliefs and his contempt for the confederate constiutition. Let's hear it."

Where do you get off demanding a statement from me? How about I demand that you immediately criticize Abraham Lincoln for his terrible racist beliefs and contempt for the U.S. Constitution? Let's here it. You have not heard one word from me that would indicate I have a racist bone in my body yet you imply that by your cheap shot. Stick to your obsessive cutting and pasting. I grew up with, played ball with, fought against, fought alongside, worked for, managed, went to weddings of and funerals of descendents of slaves all my life. Some were the finest people I knew. Others were much like you: obsessed.

Slavery is an abhorrent institution but in the 1800's was widely practiced all over the world. Dinesh D'Souza made the case that the Southern slave had a higher standard of living than the majority of people on the planet at the time.

My parents and grandparents are dying off. This was a generation of Southerners who still used black servants in the household. In some cases that would be a cleaning woman coming in once a week, in other cases it would be a full time housekeeper who had equal leeway in raising the children. There was a mutual respect that I recognized from the time I was a small child. Granted that generation did not bend over backwards to bring about the civil rights era, etc. and that was their failing. But they remembered their servants in their wills, helped send their kids to school, made sure they had good cars to drive, etc.

So stick to what you know and let alone that which you don't. On second thought: just stick a fork in it.

341 posted on 02/22/2003 7:16:42 AM PST by groanup
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To: groanup
Where do you get off demanding a statement from me?

I don't know. I knew I wouldn't get it so it was a wasted effort.

How about I demand that you immediately criticize Abraham Lincoln for his terrible racist beliefs and contempt for the U.S. Constitution?

I'm not the one criticizing President Lincoln and calling him racist and accusing him of abusing the Constitution while at the same time remaining silent on Jefferson Davis.

You have not heard one word from me that would indicate I have a racist bone in my body yet you imply that by your cheap shot.

I have not accused you of being racist. I don't know you well enough to make that decision. I'm accusing you of being a hypocrite. There's a difference.

Dinesh D'Souza made the case that the Southern slave had a higher standard of living than the majority of people on the planet at the time.

They still would have a higher standard of living than most people on this planet but that isn't a reason to bring it back. It was wrong. Human beings bought and sold like cattle to the benefit of others simply because of the color of their skin is an abomination. If you can't see that the moral repugnance of such an institution transcends simple economics then nothing I can say will change that. And respecting an individual while seeing nothing wrong with discriminating against them as a race is wrong, too, regardless of how it is suger-coated.

342 posted on 02/22/2003 7:35:19 AM PST by Non-Sequitur
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To: groanup
You have not heard one word from me that would indicate I have a racist bone in my body yet you imply that by your cheap shot.

No, you just defend racists unconditionally.
346 posted on 02/22/2003 8:57:27 AM PST by Conservative til I die
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To: groanup
There was a mutual respect

Sure, as long as the black "boys" -as grown black men were called then- knew their place.
347 posted on 02/22/2003 8:58:48 AM PST by Conservative til I die
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To: groanup; Conservative til I die; Non-Sequitur
The fact of the matter is that the political leadership of both the North and the South would qualify as racist by modern standards. I do not believe the relative degree is all that important.

Nearly every reputable historian agrees that Lincoln freed the slaves as a war measure. It was a brilliant tactical move. Having been badly battered during the first 2 years of the war, and fearing British and/or French intervention on the side of the Confederacy, he issued the Emancipation Proclamation, which just about guaranteed that the Europeans would not intervene. The Emancipation Proclamation and the loss of Jackson were the twin blows in the first 6 months of 1863 from which the Confederacy never recovered.

The Confederate political leadership, overruling the recommendations of its generals (including Lee and Patrick Cleburne in the West, among others), would not support a plan to emancipate the slaves who fought for the South. They only adopted such a plan in 1865 when it was too late. Tragically, from the southern perspective, Cleburne was denied further promotions as punishment for advancing this plan in 1862, in spite of his sterling battlefield record.

349 posted on 02/22/2003 9:17:47 AM PST by Brices Crossroads
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