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Refuting Darwinism, point by point
WorldNetDaily,com ^ | 1-11-03 | Interview of James Perloff

Posted on 01/11/2003 9:53:34 PM PST by DWar

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To: Stultis
Creationists, for instance, are certain that Archaeopteryx is in no sense transitional, or indicative of any transition, between reptiles and birds.

That bird has no known ancestors and birds did not arise till more than 50 million years later. There is no way it can be claimed as either an ancestor to birds or as proof of Darwinian evolution.

101 posted on 01/12/2003 3:08:21 PM PST by gore3000
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To: Dimensio
Liked your typical 'dishonest evolutionist' tactic of actually trying to discuss the real theory of evolution rather than some creationist strawman version.

It is the evolutionists which give phony versions of their theory - because they are ashamed of it. Here is the theory - in Darwin's own words:

"It is interesting to contemplate an entangled bank, clothed with many plants of many kinds, with birds singing on the bushes, with various insects flitting about, and with worms crawling through the damp earth, and to reflect that these elaborately constructed forms, so different from each other, and dependent on each other in so complex a manner, have all been produced by laws acting around us. These laws, taken in the largest sense, being Growth with Reproduction; Inheritance which is almost implied by reproduction; Variability from the indirect and direct action of the external conditions of life, and from use and disuse;. a Ratio of Increase so high as to lead to a Struggle for Life, and as a consequence to Natural Selection, entailing Divergence of Character and the Extinction of less-improved forms. Thus, from the war of nature, from famine and death, the most exalted object which we are capable of conceiving, namely, the production of the higher animals, directly follows."
From: Charles Darwin, "On the Origin of Species by Means of Natural Selection, or the Preservation of Favoured Races in the Struggle for Life"

102 posted on 01/12/2003 3:12:55 PM PST by gore3000
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To: PatrickHenry
How do we get moved to the Smokey Backroom to minimize the "Blue Spew"?
103 posted on 01/12/2003 3:15:23 PM PST by balrog666 (PH is really a great guy!)
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To: Dimensio
No, development of an organism starting from a fertilized egg has nothing to do with evolution.

So you are making the absurd statement that when a species transforms itself into a totally new species with new faculties, new features, new abilities it does not need to change the developmental process of the species to achieve these changes? Are you really that clueless?

104 posted on 01/12/2003 3:15:50 PM PST by gore3000
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To: Dimensio
The statement that evolution implies atheism is already so obviously false as to not be worth denying.

Darwin and all the major proponents of evolution have been atheists. You call that coincidence I guess?

105 posted on 01/12/2003 3:17:10 PM PST by gore3000
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To: balrog666
How do we get moved to the Smokey Backroom to minimize the "Blue Spew"?

If you cannot win, have thread pulled. Shows exactly what you folks are. You cannot stand the light of truth.

106 posted on 01/12/2003 3:18:58 PM PST by gore3000
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To: gore3000
Darwin and all the major proponents of evolution have been atheists. You call that coincidence I guess?

No, I call that 'factually inaccurate'.
107 posted on 01/12/2003 3:23:33 PM PST by Dimensio
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To: gore3000
So you are making the absurd statement that when a species transforms itself into a totally new species with new faculties, new features, new abilities it does not need to change the developmental process of the species to achieve these changes?

No, I am saying that the development of a fertilized egg cell into a fully-formed individual with differentiated cells is not part of the study of evolution. Any other 'points' of mine that you'd like to make up?
108 posted on 01/12/2003 3:24:39 PM PST by Dimensio
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To: gore3000
You cannot deny his statements

In fact I can and do deny Perloff's implicit claim that evolution and creation are mutually exclusive and mutually exhaustive alternatives. This is a childishly simplistic claim that doesn't withstand the most cursory examination (e.g. the observation that versions of creationist belief, with progressive creationism in the middle, grade rather smoothly into evolutionary views) and is held exclusively by fanatics as a matter of dogma. However in the present case I limited myself to pointing out that this view of the issue is exactly the same as that of (what might be called) "scientific" or "naive" atheism.

Again, Perloff is in full agreement with the most aggressive and dogmatic sort of atheist about the philosophical framing of the "origins" issue. The only disagreement concerns the mere matter of which "side" is correct. IOW, Perloff is saying that, if you find evolutionary theory credible, you should be an atheist. To the extent, then, that Perloff's supposed "scientific" arguments against evolution are wanting (as they certainly are) he is promoting atheism.

109 posted on 01/12/2003 3:25:23 PM PST by Stultis
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To: gore3000
I see nothing in that paragraph where Darwin includes the ultimate origins of life as a prt of the theory of evolution.
110 posted on 01/12/2003 3:25:48 PM PST by Dimensio
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To: gore3000
Yup, but you attack the messenger instead of trying to disprove the message.

The message 'evolution leads to atheism' is dishonest and false, it's a widely discredited lie. Pretending that evolution requires that no gods exist is either an excercise in blatant dishonesty or irredeemable stupidity. There is neither the statement nor the implication that 'there are no gods' within the theory of evolution.
111 posted on 01/12/2003 3:27:40 PM PST by Dimensio
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To: gore3000
If you cannot win, have thread pulled. Shows exactly what you folks are. You cannot stand the light of truth.

I must admit that I really wonder if you truly are as stupid as you pretend to be.

112 posted on 01/12/2003 4:01:10 PM PST by balrog666 (PH is really a great guy!)
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To: gore3000
Darwin and all the major proponents of evolution have been atheists.

Darwin was not (as I have proved to you repeatedly) an "atheist," although he did come close later in life, and could be reasonably described as a religious skeptic or "free thinker." There have been many "major proponents of evolution" who have been theists. The first important defender of evolution in America, for instance, and the only American member of Darwin's "inner circle" (those with whom with he shared his ideas prior to their publication) was the Harvard botanist Asa Gray, an evangelical Christian. Another example is James Dwight Dana.

113 posted on 01/12/2003 4:09:31 PM PST by Stultis
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To: gore3000
That bird has no known ancestors and birds did not arise till more than 50 million years later.

Hehehe.

114 posted on 01/12/2003 4:12:42 PM PST by Stultis
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To: balrog666
How do we get moved to the Smokey Backroom to minimize the "Blue Spew"?

I donno. The mods move in wondrous ways.

115 posted on 01/12/2003 4:13:33 PM PST by PatrickHenry (Your tag had me going for a minute.)
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To: Dimensio
Actually the misunderstanding of the SLoT isn't any worse than the presumption of macroevolution.
116 posted on 01/12/2003 4:21:10 PM PST by WriteOn
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To: All
The quote from Darwin in post 102 omits the final sentence, which is this:
There is grandeur in this view of life, with its several powers, having been originally breathed into a few forms or into one; and that, whilst this planet has gone cycling on according to the fixed law of gravity, from so simple a beginning endless forms most beautiful and most wonderful have been, and are being, evolved.
This gives a slightly different impression than the edited version in post 102.
117 posted on 01/12/2003 4:33:17 PM PST by PatrickHenry (PH is really a great guy!)
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To: Stultis
Actually, I'd forgotten gore3000's dishonest tactic regarding this matter. He insists that evolution is atheistic, then claims that anyone who accepts evolution is an atheist (he called Freeper Junior, who professes to be a Catholic, an atheist just because of Junior's acceptance of evolution). This way, using the 'gore3000' definition of atheist rather than any definition accepted by rational people, he can more or less 'honestly' call every prominent evolutionist an atheist, even if they professed a belief in a god.
118 posted on 01/12/2003 4:34:52 PM PST by Dimensio
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To: balrog666
I must admit that I really wonder if you truly are as stupid as you pretend to be.

I certainly think he is!

119 posted on 01/12/2003 4:35:22 PM PST by RadioAstronomer
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To: RadioAstronomer
Hi, RA!
120 posted on 01/12/2003 4:37:14 PM PST by PatrickHenry (PH is really a great guy!)
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