Postcard USA: Open Season on Islam

Daily Times [Pakistan] ^ | January 5, 2003 | Khalid Hasan

[Republic of Texas]

Actually our views are probably similar, except that I don't spend endless hours here defending Muslims. If they don'y care to defend themselves, then they, and their supporters, i.e. you, have a serious PR problem.

Since 70% of what our government does today, is not provided for in the Constitution, it is possible that the Constitution may not be enough to protect them. If they wanted to live here peacefully, the wise thing to do would be to find a way to convince Americans that they love this country, they love freedom, and they want peace. If they really wanted to live here peacefully.

[Jhoffa_]

When FReepers start tossing aside the Constitution to make it easier to vent our 9-11-01 rage, we're in big trouble.

Indeed. I agree completely.

A federal government that's powerful enough to round up peaceful Muslim citzens and ship them off in clear violation of the First Amendment, is also powerful enough to ship Jews and Christians off as well.

I thought this was common sense, obviously I was mistaken.

[Jhoffa_]

Actually our views are probably similar, except that I don't spend endless hours here defending Muslims.

I thought so, I honestly think most people don't have any objections to a peaceful muslim living down the street, so long as he doesn't break the law.

I am not defending muslims as such, and I couldn't defend some of their actions abroad even if I wanted to.

I just happen to have run across some very nice, peaceful and devout American Muslims who don't fit the "jihad" stereotype at all. Believe me, of all the people I encountered on a daily basis while working in cincy, they were the very least of my worries. (And that's actually saying quite allot when you think about the racial problems Cincy has)

If they don'y care to defend themselves, then they, and their supporters, i.e. you, have a serious PR problem.

PR is their problem. I am a Christian, they can deal with their own PR, afaiac. It certainly won't affect my religion and how it's perceived by the public at large.

[swarthyguy]

That's such a phenomenal attitude.

Yes, we have no right to demand an accounting from anyone.

Least of all the arab/pakistani adherents to a religion in whose name 17 "misguided" souls terrorised this country.

Kumbaya and Shanti Om to you too.

I've accepted the reality. Many many, the vast majority of muslims in America particularly arabs and pakistanis have not. They can't even see the reality staring them in the face.

It's very late; 17 months after September 2001 and the majority of the American people don't buy their protestations or condemnations or allegiance to America.
That's something to think about.

[Odile]

No. Sorry. He's not an "ass," he's a semi-professional Muslim apologist -- obviously some sort of a plant from CAIR -- or else just one of those people who enjoys drawing attention to himself -- however unfavorable. -- Probably the latter. Their name, unfortunately, is LEGION -- particularly on internet websites such as this.

It would be wise if we could refrain from making this debate PERSONAL -- tempting though that may be. Friend Jhoffa will never relent -- never even admit he might be wrong --, so perhaps it's best to ignore him. (And yes, I admit I ought to take my own advice. I've devoted far too much time to this nonsense already.)

I frankly think we are dealing with someone who is addicted to DISPUTE for the sake of dispute.

I am delighted to see that so many here do NOT agree with Jhoffa's narrow legalistic interpretation of our constitution. As I've already stated in several posts, the Constitution of the United States of America is Not a SUICIDE PACT.

And ISLAM -- no matter what face it may choose to show to the naive and gullible -- is not a RELIGION, it is a SUBVERSION.

[Jhoffa_]

Anyone that gets above the 50's should be forced to eat falafil every day until they apologize.

LOL!

I don't care if anyone apologizes. I do however think they aren't doing the first amendment justice when you look at the incredible variety of religions we have here in the States and how well they all interact and get along.

You have bona-fied Satan Worshipers living next to Conservative Christians, Jews living next to Muslims, tree worshipers and other earth based stuff, spirit based Indian type beliefs, Hindu's.. etc. And everyone get's along just fine. compare that to the rest of the planet.

There's no need to change a thing or to discriminate against any law abiding group because of their religion. It's just not the doomsday scenario I see some people painting.

[Republic of Texas]

Couldn't agree more.

[tracer]

Ah, yes. Another roommate for Rushdie....

[Jhoffa_]

Yes, we have no right to demand an accounting from anyone.

No, you don't.. and before you go off on another tirade about my "arrogance" just remember that you also don't owe the queers any explanation for your (hypothetical) religious objection to their lifestyle. Or the Muslims, or the Jews, or anybody.

They may not like you for it, but it's your right under the Constitution. We punish behaviors here, anything more is akin to "thought crimes" and it's dangerous territory.

[Odile]

//Moslems have as much right to be in America now as did NAZIs in the 1940s or Commies in the 1950s and 1960s.\\

THANK you! Thank you very MUCH!

You said it in a nutshell.

Case closed. (Don't you wish? :-)

AMEN!

[Jhoffa_]

Friend Jhoffa will never relent -- never even admit he might be wrong --, so perhaps it's best to ignore him. (And yes, I admit I ought to take my own advice....)

By all means, please do so...

[tracer]

Ah, yes. Another roommate for Rushdie....

[Odile]

//Moslems have as much right to be in America now as did NAZIs in the 1940s or Commies in the 1950s and 1960s.\\

THANK you! Thank you very MUCH!

You said it in a nutshell.

Case closed. (Don't you wish? :-)

AMEN!

[k2blader]

Okay, thanks. I was generally "glossing through" this thread earlier but will have to re-read more closely.

Maybe I missed the posts calling for mass deportation of American citizens simply because they are Muslim, which with I would completely disagree.

[k2blader]

which with = with which

(whew)

[Jhoffa_]

Maybe I missed the posts calling for mass deportation of American citizens simply because they are Muslim, which with I would completely disagree.

It's in there..

Along with a bunch of other stuff that's, well just very unflattering to the other side of the argument.

[antaresequity]

What is wrong with hate?...I hate Islamo Facists, and think the Islamic world is making a huge mistake not dealing with it themsleves. The 90% majority of "silent" Islamists better speak up hard and fast...and join us in arms or they will be on receiving end of some pretty nasty sentiment, and hot steel...

Tough luck...

[swarthyguy]

Specious arguments. We were attacked in the name of Islam.

It is absolutely incumbent upon the adherents of the religion who do not agree with the jihadis to provide an accounting.

Both in terms of normal human interactions in the society they live in and for their own self preservation and protection.

Obviously you cannot see that human factor and prefer the legal idealisms - yes, the Constitution offers protection but not to those who attack us.

[Jhoffa_]

What is wrong with hate?.

You can hate, it's your right..

By all means, hate away!

[Odile]

Auntie to Jhoffa:

//The Supreme Court claims they have read the Constitution, but they ruled against the Mormons anyway. Using that precedent, they should also rule against the murdering Muslims religion.\\

//You avoided any response to the Mormon precedent. If the SC can rule it is constitutional to seize Mormon buildings, imprison them and disband their church for believing in and practicing plural marriage, why is it Unconstitutional to seize Muslim mosques, imprison Muslims and disband their church for believing in and practicing murdering non-believers? . . . Using the PC canard of "fairness" would require us to apply the same "constitutional" standard to the Muslims. . .\\

BRAVO! BRAVO! I LOVE your post, Auntie! Thank you! It bolsters everything I've tried to say with historical facts and exquisitely clear logic.

I don't know who this "Jhoffa" is, but he must be one of "THEM," 'cause he sure ain't one of US.

I just need to add -- again and again -- that I do not favor VIOLENCE towards these people -- only getting their hands off the levers of power, their access to our Civil Courts denied, and their evil scheming minions OUT of circulation here and ISOLATED -- preferably in the Middle East -- the ONLY place they rightfully belong.