Throw your stones when you yourself are sinless, otherwise, leave the judging to God, pal.
Posted on 12/27/2002 12:16:35 AM PST by kattracks
Much of that money MUST have been amassed by "immoral" means; there were prostitutes, tax collectors, and (I'm sure) even thieves among them.
There is no indication the apostles had any trouble accepting it.
gsg:Why don't you post that scripture for us Mr Bible Sinner Man...
Ephesians 4
Unity in the Body of Christ
1As a prisoner for the Lord, then, I urge you to live a life worthy of the calling you have received.
2Be completely humble and gentle; be patient, bearing with one another in love.
3Make every effort to keep the unity of the Spirit through the bond of peace.
4There is one body and one Spirit--just as you were called to one hope when you were called--
5one Lord, one faith, one baptism;
6one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all.
7But to each one of us grace has been given as Christ apportioned it.
8This is why it[1] says: "When he ascended on high, he led captives in his train and gave gifts to men."[2]
9(What does "he ascended" mean except that he also descended to the lower, earthly regions[3] ?
10He who descended is the very one who ascended higher than all the heavens, in order to fill the whole universe.)
11It was he who gave some to be apostles, some to be prophets, some to be evangelists, and some to be pastors and teachers,
12to prepare God's people for works of service, so that the body of Christ may be built up
13until we all reach unity in the faith and in the knowledge of the Son of God and become mature, attaining to the whole measure of the fullness of Christ.
14Then we will no longer be infants, tossed back and forth by the waves, and blown here and there by every wind of teaching and by the cunning and craftiness of men in their deceitful scheming.
15Instead, speaking the truth in love, we will in all things grow up into him who is the Head, that is, Christ.
16From him the whole body, joined and held together by every supporting ligament, grows and builds itself up in love, as each part does its work.
Living as Children of Light
17So I tell you this, and insist on it in the Lord, that you must no longer live as the Gentiles do, in the futility of their thinking.
18They are darkened in their understanding and separated from the life of God because of the ignorance that is in them due to the hardening of their hearts.
19Having lost all sensitivity, they have given themselves over to sensuality so as to indulge in every kind of impurity, with a continual lust for more.
20You, however, did not come to know Christ that way.
21Surely you heard of him and were taught in him in accordance with the truth that is in Jesus.
22You were taught, with regard to your former way of life, to put off your old self, which is being corrupted by its deceitful desires;
23to be made new in the attitude of your minds;
24and to put on the new self, created to be like God in true righteousness and holiness.
25Therefore each of you must put off falsehood and speak truthfully to his neighbor, for we are all members of one body.
26"In your anger do not sin"[4] : Do not let the sun go down while you are still angry,
27and do not give the devil a foothold.
28He who has been stealing must steal no longer, but must work, doing something useful with his own hands, that he may have something to share with those in need.
29Do not let any unwholesome talk come out of your mouths, but only what is helpful for building others up according to their needs, that it may benefit those who listen.
30And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, with whom you were sealed for the day of redemption.
31Get rid of all bitterness, rage and anger, brawling and slander, along with every form of malice.
32Be kind and compassionate to one another, forgiving each other, just as in Christ God forgave you.
against your insults? - I think your tenor indicates you are clearly a contentious spirit - rather, that being the case, our conversation is complete.
One short question though - since Ep 4 says "24and to put on the new self, created to be like God in true righteousness and holiness."
......does God gamble ?
Throw your stones when you yourself are sinless, otherwise, leave the judging to God, pal.
sooo... calling gambling a sin is "judgemental" and akin to "stone throwing" -
You havent answered the question.........Ep 4 says "24and to put on the new self, created to be like God in true righteousness and holiness."
Does God gamble..........pal?
Nope. God is perfect and doesnt sin in any way. You and I, on the other hand, do sin. All Christians should try very hard not to sin yet we know we fall short of this goal.
This man has done nothing wrong. He doesnt have a history of being a compulsive gambler and only buys a ticket when it reaches over 100 million based on his belief it wouldnt be worth the money. THis man was blessed by God, in my opinion, given the money to benefit the poor and downtrodden in his home state. Have you even been to West Virginia with all the flooding and loss of homes and lives? God works in ways you cannot dream to understand and you have no place in telling anyone that based on your understandings the tithings are tainted and shouldnt be accepted.
Where do you work? Does the business have any immoral practice in making its money like flakey budgeting and misleading advertising? Wouldnt that considered tainted in your book?
I will pray for you in hopes you wont be so judgemental on your fellow man.
youre doing good here - and we are in complete agreement
This man has done nothing wrong.
This is where we disagree -
He doesnt have a history of being a compulsive gambler and only buys a ticket when it reaches over 100 million based on his belief it wouldnt be worth the money
....so the occasional drunkard / crack smoker / gambler neednt be told thier non compulsion is detrimental to the fabric of thier soul due to the notion that the individual pointing it out to them is judgemental and because it is only practiced occasionally? - sorry, theyve still turned away from God in thier sin, and He will judge them for that.
What a terrible power to wield over people.
Wasn't it Einstein who said something like: God doesn't play dice with the world?"
Sorry, you're wrong here, in my opinion.
God judges us all based on our acceptance in Christ Jesus. Not on a gambling habit or our dependence on cigarettes. All these sins are earthly and equal in Gods eyes. Our goal is to aim to please God with our efforts for a more Jesus like lifestyle. We are not condemned to hell for winning a lottery and giving 10% to church.
A Church shouldnt deny tithings if they are given from the heart which I believe this man has proven through his tithing history.
I havent had time to dig, is that your presumption or fact?
..
to which you are kindly entitled
God judges us all based on our acceptance in Christ Jesus. Not on a gambling habit or our dependence on cigarettes. All these sins are earthly and equal in Gods eyes. Our goal is to aim to please God with our efforts for a more Jesus like lifestyle.
Go back and read Ep 5 - you have it right, but with a worldy eye you see Christ as a smoker & gambler.
We are not condemned to hell for winning a lottery and giving 10% to church.
and IMO, if the sin was committed after accepting Christ in the second baptism, a conscious effort was made to sin- the next question raised then, is that sin "unpardonable"?
A Church shouldnt deny tithings if they are given from the heart which I believe this man has proven through his tithing history.
and my point is a right heart wouldnt gamble - the primary point being - I see it as a sin whereas others dont -
I respectfully disagree with you:
Gods grace is overflowing and cannot be contained. You are forgiven for every sin--past, present, and future. You will never be condemned by God or separated from Him if you have truely accepted him as your savior.(Rom. 8:1-2, 31-39)
Its a huge ethical question - On one hand do you deny the gift, citing the original source, or do you accept it, hoping to build the brother into a right relationship.
I know of instances in Free Methodism where both have occurred.
did you have a good Christmas?....still digging out ?
are there any unpardonable sins?
........and believe it or not - I AGREE with you LOL - I am an ex drinker, smoker, gambler, potty mouth, biker - Jesus atoned for all of them - that doesnt give me free reign to continue in sin (abusing alcohol or gambling)- Quite the contrary - we should desire sinless perfection (personal holiness - entire sanctification)-
Nice catch... the point I was making is no sin in unpardonable. If you have accepted Christ, your sins are washed. I never said free reign of sin is allowed and people who do this (sin freely using Christs salvation as cover) misunderstand the meaning of Christianity. I hardly find spending 10 dollars on a lotto ticket in the slight chance (or blessing) that you may win is rejecting Christ and all that he stands for.
Simple question... have you cussed, wagered, felt attracted to another person other than your spouse since finding Christ? These things are not purposely done. God doesnt sweep the urge to sin away and acting upon a sin doesnt constitute damnation. We are human and God knows we are natural sinners.
I cant honestly believe you if you say you have never sinned since your walk with Jesus has started. What constitutes as an "unpardonable" sin?
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