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Vatican acknowledges pope's shortcomings during Holocaust
Agence France-Presse (via ClariNet) ^
Posted on 12/20/2002 3:16:07 PM PST by RCW2001
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To: Maynerd
Utterly untrue. The Church spoke out against Nazism early on. It is true the immediate danger was the persecution of religion by the Communists, but the Church warned the public of the evils of Nazism even before it came to power. This article is such tired stuff. Its contents are constantly refuted, but people who hate Catholicism want it all to be true, so they keep repeating this crap, hoping some of it will stick.
To: RCW2001
And?
22
posted on
12/20/2002 11:01:33 PM PST
by
fatima
To: wideawake
Thank you dear souls,eternal rest.
23
posted on
12/20/2002 11:08:50 PM PST
by
fatima
To: wideawake
Prove it .
24
posted on
12/20/2002 11:10:53 PM PST
by
fatima
To: Maynerd
The record speaks for itself, regardless of what Paul Johnson says. Pius XII gave the COMMAND that all monasteries and convents were to hide Jews--at risk of their own lives. He himself hid thousands in the Vatican. He falsified papers and passports and distributed them to Jews across Europe. He organized food deliveries and each day the vans were secretly dispatched to deliver food throughout Italy--to feed Jewish refugees. Pius XII himself would not eat or drink anything not available for refugees. When the war was over he was hailed as a hero by Einstein, by Golda Meir, by the chief rabbi of Rome, among other Jewish leaders of that time. No one did more to rescue Jews. It is estimated he saved about 800,000+, conservatively, more than any other individual. Do you think a stronger speech would have helped? The Catholic hierarchy tried that and precipitated a catastrophe in the Netherlands. When its bishops publicly denounced Nazism for its barbaric treatment of Jews, the Nazis immediately ordered the roundup of hundreds of thousands of Dutch Jews. The Jews themselves begged the Church to keep a low profile since to speak out made matters worse. It was an evil time beyond imagining.
To: ultima ratio
No disrespect, but Paul Johnson is not a half baked political hack writing an op ed piece to gain attention. If anything Johnson is inherently biased in favor of conservatism and the church.
I realize there is a trememdous media bias against the Catholic Church. However the church is not without influence and has more than its share of political machinations. The truth will declare itself eventually.
26
posted on
12/21/2002 12:26:30 AM PST
by
Maynerd
To: sinkspur
I mean he buys the thesis that there was some kind of natural animosity in temper and doctrine between Pius XII and John XXIII and to praise the one is to spurn the other.
Pius XII and John XXIII were Popes, but they were men also. There is a sentiment among Catholics of a certain generation that John XXIII was a prophet sent by the Holy Spirit - the "sweetness-and-light" I was referring to.
To: fatima
Prove it.Read Johnson's History of Christianity and compare his respective assessments of Pius IX and John XXIII.
To: Maynerd
Merry Christmas Maynerd
29
posted on
12/22/2002 10:03:42 AM PST
by
ladyjane
To: Maynerd
The truth will declare itself eventually. Slowly but surely, it is.
To: ladyjane
Thankyou and likewise.
31
posted on
12/22/2002 2:01:39 PM PST
by
Maynerd
To: RCW2001
Crap.
32
posted on
12/22/2002 10:10:04 PM PST
by
fatima
To: Maynerd
I don't think so. When the pope spoke out there was retribution. Diplomacy is used for a reason, sometimes to soothe feelings until you have the power to do something about it. The vatican didn't fight in the war and it is a fact that the vatican and many priests did as much as they possibly could to save Jews including giving their lives. This problem with Pacelli is just revisionist history. Someone wants to make a political point and others follow along like sheep because that is what they want to think anyway, anything to discredit the Catholic Church. But that's ok Jesus said it would be under attack and we naturally expect it.
33
posted on
12/22/2002 10:39:41 PM PST
by
tiki
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