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To: Joe Bonforte
First, let me say that I do not support a FEDERAL WOD. I believe it is a state issue. Specifically, I believe pot should be legalized, but I still believe hard drugs such as cocaine, heroine, pcp, meth, ect should remain illegal.

To examine the proposition by Libertarians, and now Mr. Burton we must look at the entire picture, and the end result.

You are correct to assume that, in accordance with the nature of supply and demand, by reducing the supply, you increase the demand and by increasing the demand you raise the value of said product or service.

So, yes, by reducing the ability of hard drugs to find their way to the US, you increase the market value of those drugs. By doing that, you raise the motivation of dealers and producers to produce and send more drugs to the US. In contrast, by legalizing, you will indeed cut the legs out from under the cartels and dealers.

However we must also weight the effects of said action to the consumers of these narcotics. While the mean ol' cartels would likely go out of business, the consumers of the legalized substances would have more motivation to use. The product would be more readily available, for a cheaper price, and with a virtually nill likelyhood of getting a bad product.

So, while you may have remedied the supply side, killing off the cartels and giving the job of production over to corporations, you INCREASE the motivation of users and non users to use MORE.

I don't see that as a good thing.

4 posted on 12/17/2002 9:53:03 AM PST by Texaggie79
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To: Texaggie79
you INCREASE the motivation of users and non users to use MORE.

There was no drug war until about 90 years ago. But there were plenty of drugs readily available even right in the Sears and Roebuck cataloge (cocaine). Yet we had a smaller problem with drug use than now.

I submit that if people want to use drugs, they will. No matter if its legal or not. So I don't believe your premise that you INCREASE the motivation of users. Yes, the price is lower. But availability (if retail sales of drugs is still illegal) may be less than today because there's no big money to be made. So I believe that if done correctly, drug legalization can actually help the drug USE problem

10 posted on 12/17/2002 10:03:35 AM PST by narby
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To: Texaggie79
I don't see that as a good thing.

I understand your concern, though I don't share it because I don't believe making drugs legal would lead to the dire consequences you predict. But let's assume those consequences did come true. Do you believe that situation is worse than what we have now?

Remember the hundreds of thousands in prison for non-violent offenses, ripping up families and leaving kids without parents. Remember the hundreds or thousands killed each year in the drug war violence, many of them innocent bystanders. Remember the erosion of Constitutional rights as the 4th Amendment becomes practically meaningless.

I'm not trying to bait you. I just want to know if you really think all those things are preferable to increased drug usage - hypothetical increased usage at that.

11 posted on 12/17/2002 10:04:38 AM PST by Joe Bonforte
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To: Texaggie79
So, while you may have remedied the supply side, killing off the cartels and giving the job of production over to corporations, you INCREASE the motivation of users and non users to use MORE.

I don't see that as a good thing.

Just like ending Prohibition reduced the disincentives of alcohol users. Was that a good thing? If not, should Prohibition have been continued?

And why should I, a non-drug-user, have to pay---in tax dollars, a justice system corupted by drug money, and increased threat from drug-turf wars---to "protect" others from their own weaknesses?

12 posted on 12/17/2002 10:06:55 AM PST by MrLeRoy
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To: Texaggie79
While the mean ol' cartels would likely go out of business, the consumers of the legalized substances would have more motivation to use. The product would be more readily available, for a cheaper price, and with a virtually nill likelyhood of getting a bad product.

So, while you may have remedied the supply side, killing off the cartels and giving the job of production over to corporations, you INCREASE the motivation of users and non users to use MORE.

Your analogy only works in terms of a general commodity market, where cost is the only downside. Drugs have their own inherent cost, and people recognize that. If cost was the primary deterrent to people doing drugs, I'd think you would see a substantial increase in drug use as you move up the economic scale, but you don't. Removing the profit from drugs stands to have a much greater affect on the associated crime rate than the rate of usage because there are much different motivating factors involved, respectively. - IMHO

18 posted on 12/17/2002 10:24:50 AM PST by tacticalogic
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To: Texaggie79

So, while you may have remedied the supply side, killing off the cartels and giving the job of production over to corporations, you INCREASE the motivation of users and non users to use MORE.

I don't see that as a good thing.

Hear, hear!

27 posted on 12/17/2002 10:40:51 AM PST by Chemist_Geek
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To: Texaggie79
So, while you may have remedied the supply side, killing off the cartels and giving the job of production over to corporations, you INCREASE the motivation of users and non users to use MORE. I don't see that as a good thing.

I think it would be: Uncle Chuck Darwin's way of cleaning out that ring around the gene pool.

113 posted on 12/17/2002 12:08:19 PM PST by BlazingArizona
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To: Texaggie79
"...you INCREASE the motivation of users and non users to use MORE."

I don't buy it. People who are intent to do drugs, will, whether they are illegal or not. People who don't do drugs wont do drugs, even if it is made legal to do so. For those that want to do drugs and get high, I say we should give them all the drugs they want free of charge and let them kill themselves. The drug problem would solve itself.

132 posted on 12/17/2002 12:47:48 PM PST by semaj
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To: Texaggie79
First, let me say that I do not support a FEDERAL WOD. I believe it is a state issue. Specifically, I believe pot should be legalized, but I still believe hard drugs such as cocaine, heroine, pcp, meth, ect should remain illegal.

MEANINGLESS! Because once you legalize pot the rest will follow. Give an inch and they will take a mile. Legal marijuana is their Trojan horse. Same happened with affirmative action, which was originally just for Blacks and American Indians. Now everyone (except white males) has hopped on board that gravy train. Including women (51% of the population!) and fresh off the boat immigrants.

338 posted on 12/18/2002 9:07:35 AM PST by dennisw
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