'Finding' Rosie O'Donnell: The 'Rosie Empire' crashes in another celebrity's 'self-outing'

"If I remember correctly, one of the women on The View said 'Thank you, Jesus.' The editors censored the 'J-word' in the West Coast broadcast of the show. Can anybody help me out on this one?"

Well although there's no way I could say for certain having never watched that thing?
If it'd been anyone from amoung that flock of old hens to make such a statement it'd probably have been, "Star Jones."
(~& that could just be two Rs instead of one in a name like that, too.)

She has every reason to plead for Divine Intervention any & every chance she gets; &, on a number of matters.

...her bulbous size for one & her equally big mouth, for another.

70 percent cure rate is a fairly specific number, obviously a 30 percent "failure" rate would leave many in need of further treatment. So at least 70 percent of highly motivated people seem be able to get beyond their problems and lead a fruitful noble life under the Aegis of these faith-based groups.

As to my comments regarding biases and Kinsey, they are quite germaine to the discussion. The modernists opposed to the notion that homosexuality is an abnormal lifestyle, rely on the Kinsey studies as the basis of their views. Kinsey's study methods were flawed, relying on data from imprisoned sex offenders, relying on data gained from the observed sexual exploitation and genital manipulations of young children by so called"researchers", in so called control situations. The Kinsey institute remains closed mouthed as to where it got the children for its studies, the disposition of those children afterward, and whether or not follow-up was done regarding lasting psychological harm was done. The data gained from observing adult couples, hetero and homo is also corrupt, not taking acount that these couples may have felt that they had something to prove or exhibit and may not have been fully representative of America at large. The adherents of Kinsey's theories would naturally be disposed to deny that homosexuality is a true pathology, or at least a treatable one.

As to your comments regarding faith and logic. There is always to be an epistomological gap between knowledge of an object and that object itself. You decide to turn a light on in full expectation that it will work, and imagine your disappointment when the bulb is burned out. Logic is like a perpetual virgin which cannot soil herself with notions of right or wrong or ethics. She can only answer yes or no, a thing is so or it is not so, and will mock you if you say "I have decided on the basis of logic!". "Oh but sir," she'll reply"you must have bedded another woman, I had no part in your decision...I can only point out alternatives, not wed myself with BIAS!But I'm acquanted with Faith and I know Hope very well...they are often a reliever of despair in a way that I cannot palliate!"

Ironically classical rationalism and rational arguements started from given premises(ie. God exists) but since the 1600's terms like rational and irrational have been turned on their ear. It is my contention that it is irrational not to include faith, or hope, in any logical discussion as a true logical arguement forces those engaged in it to face their own internal biases, hopes, and fears and to embrace any evidence honestly, no matter where it logically leads. Any decisions based on such evidence must inevitably be based beyond the realm of logic and into the realm of hope and faith, of things longed for, the expectations of things to come. Logic can be abused and used to justify all manner of evil...in the name of LOGIC...but classical logic is not the slave of personal bias, but like the two edged sword that cuts both ways, it will certainly point personal bias out! You would be more honest not to argue from logic, for logic's sake!

So tell me sir, what has made you so bitter against God and TRUE LOGIC, true reason? (John chapter 1..In the beginning was the Word{LOGOS}, and the {LOGOS} Word was with God and was God.....and the Word{LOGOS} was made Flesh...)(Logos was the greek term for {word} in John chapter 1. Logos from which we get the word..."logic")!

But I also said that many Homosexuals may also lose their former compulsions completely...it just depended on how the Spirit was working in their lives. A thief may lose his compulsion to steal completely or may not. I admit to using a faith based arguement in my discussion with you despite your view that faith has no place in a logical arguement. My contention regarding logic is that logic governs the conduct of the arguement including forcing those conducting the arguement to view the evidence pro and con...logic itself can never be the basis for any arguement. Logic never decides anything, but it enforces honesty amongst the debaters. It is logic that leads the horse to water so to speak, but it remains within the personal vaguaries of the horse that causes him to drink it.

These faith based ministries claim a success rate of 70 percent, though I feel the truth regarding that is a bit more complex(I suppose we might have a point of agreement here). Based on my belief in God and some knowledge of my own inconsistencies, we humans are a sinful lot and will always be prone to error and temptation. But my Bible promises power to overcome sin and many a Christian has been able to do just that. These faith based ministries would probably be more accurate in describing their success rates in terms of lack of recidivism, or reversion to a homosexual lifestyle,( in terms of a continued putting off of fleshly desire, and a putting on of Christ.).

These same types of faith based groups report a 70 percent success rate in keeping people of drugs as well...groups such as Teen Challenge for example...as measured by recidivism or lack there-of.

Humans are complex and why they do the the things they do are governed by genetics and as well as enviromental and nurturing factors. Logic never quite applies to humans despite appeals to her rationality... but Faith and Hope and Love can prevail when Logic has no answer to the despair of a homosexual trapped in his or her lifestyle, and the Holy Spirit can provide most convincing internal proofs to God's love and power to save and heal!

You are wrong if you think logic can be used to decide wrongness or rightness, it can only point out alternatives or point to evidence refuting ones point. In modern "so-called logical" arguements, an arguement must be "falsifiable" to be considered a logical arguement, hence the inherent weakness of using logic as a basis of deciding what is right and wrong....it can't decide anything, only personal bias backed up by the evidence of objective data and the vaguaries of personal emotional comfort ultimately can "bring the horse to water.

Classical rationalism started with given premises and undiluted logic was used to enforce the rules of evidence based on those given premises. The problem with logic is its inherent objectivism, it never decides for you...you ultimately decide!

If a faith based ministry claims a high rate of success, and can point to actual faces, names, and data why there is the evidence that logic demands to reach a verdict of its success. The goal is to bring these poor creatures out of a destructive lifestyle and to do so permanently, they'll never claim credit for the internal change, and many will readily admit the internal struggles, all that lies in the purview of the Spirit. Scripture states that God will help..."Come let us REASON together, if your sins be as scarlet, they shall be white as snow".

You certainly know of the high rate of suicide and death/disease rate of such persons. Many former homosexuals spoke of the constant despair they felt before they found a new start in Jesus Christ. I have observed these groups when they've visited my church and I've known homosexuals who were not Christians. You might argue "snake oil and placebo effect" but even these are noted to have an effect that cannot be argued "rationally" in the modern sense of the term. If faith based ministries can keep a majority of homosexuals out of that lifestyle for beyond 3,4,5,or 10 years or more at what point can you say a cure can or cannot be effected. Scripture states.."In him..old things are passed away, behold..all things are become new". Christ can give a broken life a new start

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.