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To: MikalM
This article does not ignore the Celtic Church: Thus ended the nearly five-hundred-year history of the Anglo-Saxon Orthodox Church, which was followed by the demise of the still older Celtic Orthodox Churches in Wales, Scotland and Ireland.

Also check out the link to the revived Celtic Orthodox Church:


5 posted on 11/22/2002 11:18:53 PM PST by Destro
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To: Destro
Guess I missed that sentence. Yet it implies that the Church wasn't in Albion until the Saxon invasion, which again, is contradicted by St. Alban's martyrdom and other evidence.

On a related note: I belong to an Anglo-Catholic American Episcopal church, and have noted that in the last couple of years, the liturgy and general tone have gotten increasingly "Orthodox," especially during Easter weekend. Wonder if we're due for a revival of the Sarum Rite?

13 posted on 11/23/2002 10:45:11 AM PST by MikalM
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To: Destro; CARepubGal; MarMema; kosta50; FormerLib; drstevej
This article does not ignore the Celtic Church: Thus ended the nearly five-hundred-year history of the Anglo-Saxon Orthodox Church, which was followed by the demise of the still older Celtic Orthodox Churches in Wales, Scotland and Ireland.

Yes, it mentions the Celtic Orthodox churches (centered on the monastic college of Iona between Ireland and Scotland, i.e. "Scotia Major" and "Scotia Minor"); but in simply calling these churches "Orthodox" the article does not give a complete picture of these Churches. To wit:

All of this is entirely true. But to what does all this add up? Well, it certainly adds up to a Church which was very "Eastern Orthodox" in form and style, albeit with a Gaelic vernacular and national flavor. But it overlooks an important area of analysis -- while very Greek in form and style, what did this "Celtic Orthodox" Church believe??

When one reads, in their own words or descriptions thereof, the actual beliefs of the Celtic Orthodox Church -- a VERY interesting picture emerges!!


BELIEFS of the Celtic Orthodox Church


So what have we here?! A Church founded by Greek Orthodox, with a Greek Orthodox ecclesiology and liturgy, a Greek Orthodox-styled clergy and monastic tradition.... but their Theological Beliefs -- Sola Scriptura, Justification through Faith Alone, The Death of Free Will in the Fall, Absolute Double Predestination, Symbolic Baptism, Symbolic Eucharist -- these are not the sort of Theological Beliefs one generally associates with Greek Orthodoxy. Why, if one had to put a denominational label on them -- you could scarcely do better than "Calvinist Presbyterian".

So we have these Gaelic Churches... Greek Orthodox in their founding origin, ecclesiology, liturgy, clerical orders -- but Calvinist Presbyterian in their Theology of the Bible, of Salvation, of the Sacraments...

A Church which is at once ORTHODOX in heart...
And yet at the same time PRESBYTERIAN in mind...

Orthodox... and yet Presbyterian also....

Best Regards, Orthodox Presbyterian

26 posted on 03/08/2004 10:49:43 AM PST by OrthodoxPresbyterian (We are Unworthy Servants; We have only done Our Duty)
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To: Destro
Interesting reading on those links, they certainly appear to be more Orthodox than anything else.
Man’s Vocation to Theosis

In the book of Genesis we read: ‘And God said, Let us make man according to our image and likeness’ (Gen 1.26). The Church Fathers, since ancient times (e.g., St Irenæus of Lyons), have distinguished between the Divine image and likeness. Man was created in the image of God, but he had yet to attain His likeness, to become like God, to achieve full theosis. However, man fell. The first man, Adam, prior to his fall, possessed an internal unity through God’s Grace (charis, gratia). He was turned Godward in love. But when he sinned, he lost this special Grace which had protected and united him. The good order of his soul was corrupted, and an unnatural and sinful man came into existence. The passions that overcame man were not outside forces which entered from without and which must be uprooted. Rather, they are energies of the soul which have been distorted and need to be transformed. In the human soul, there are three faculties: the intelligent (logistikon), appetitive (epithymetikon), and the incensive (thymikon). These three faculties must be directed toward God. When they turn away from Him, they become sinful passions. A sinful passion is therefore a movement of the soul contrary to nature.

The first man did not carry out the task which lay before him, ‘to cultivate and to keep’ (Gen 2.15), to strengthen himself in goodness and co-operate with Divine Grace to attain full deification and become ‘god’ by Grace. Because of the fall, the Divine economy for man had to be adapted; however, the goal for which man was created did not change. St. Athanasios of Alexandria states that God became man so that man might become god (‘On the Incarnation’). This teaching about theosis is to be found in the writings of the Church Fathers from the earliest times; it has Biblical origins.

The idea of personal and organic union between God and man – God dwelling in us and we in Him – is set forth in the Gospel according to St John and the Epistles of St Paul. The latter sees the Christian life mainly as a life in Christ. The same idea is expressed also in the Second Epistle of St Peter: ‘According as His Divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness... that by these ye might be partakers of the Divine Nature’ (II Pet 1.3-4). In Orthodox theology, man’s salvation and redemption mean his deification. This teaching must always be understood in the light of the distinction between God’s Essence and His Energies. Union with God means union with the Divine Energies, not with the Divine Essence.

An early witness to this teaching about the distinction between the Divine Essence and Energies is provided by St. Basil the Great, one of the Cappadocian Fathers of the fourth century. In Letter 234, he writes: ‘We know our God from His Energies, but we do not claim that we can draw near to His Essence. For His Energies come down to us, but His Essence remains unapproachable.’ This teaching was later developed by one of the greatest theologians of the Orthodox Church, St. Gregory Palamas. The union between God and man is a true union, in which man retains his full personal integrity and personal characteristics without ceasing to be human.

Deification involves the body also. ‘Your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit,’ wrote the Apostle Paul (I Cor 6.19). At the Resurrection, the bodies of the Saints will be transfigured by Divine Light, as the body of the Lord was transfigured on Mount Tabor. Even in this present life, some Saints have experienced the beginning of this visible and bodily glorification. In the Apophthegmata Patrum, a collection of sayings of the Desert Fathers, we read of Abba Pambo: ‘Just as Moses received the image of the glory of Adam, when his face was glorified, so the face of Abba Pambo shone like lightning, and he was as a king seated on his throne.’ The body is sanctified and transfigured together with the soul. The Divine Grace present in the Saints’ bodies during their lifetime on earth remains active in their Relics after their death, which is the reason behind the veneration of holy Relics in the Church.

By His Incarnation, Passion, Resurrection, and Founding of the Church, the Lord opened for His most precious creature, man, the path to his true goal, to theosis. In the Mysteries of Baptism and Chrismation, a person receives the fullness of the Grace of the Holy Spirit. But he must still make this Grace ‘his own’; he must go through the process of acquiring the Holy Spirit. St. Mark the Ascetic says that Christ as Perfect God gave to the Baptised the perfect Grace of the Holy Spirit, which is revealed and manifested insofar as a person lives the Divine commandments (‘Instructions for Hesychasts’).

The call to sanctity and spiritual perfection is directed to all Christians and therefore all true Christians do everything that is in their power to acquire the Holy Spirit and to achieve inner unification and the healing of the passions. They discover that there are various steps of spiritual ascent to purification of the heart and illumination, when the intellect (nous) is united with the heart, in ceaseless prayer, to achieve theosis.

The process of spiritual advancement is not something mechanical or magical, however, as if by certain actions we can ‘force’ Divine Grace to effect our internal transformation. Divine Grace brings about this internal change when the time is ripe. But it can also be said that it works in correspondence with a person’s own struggle and efforts in repentance and humility. ‘If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children, how much more shall your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask Him?’ (Lk 11.13).The co-operation (synergy) of Divine Grace with a person’s own free will is thus required.


28 posted on 03/08/2004 11:05:30 AM PST by FormerLib ("Homosexual marriage" is just another route to anarchy.)
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