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The climate of institutional control that conservative and traditional Catholics worship is one which engenders the stifling of true spirituality, fiefdoms and coverups when those fiefdoms engage in corrupt practices. The Churches of the East booted you out over it, the Protestant Reformation occurred over it, and you guys have never learned the lesson.

There you sit, wringing your hands and whimpering in the hope that Rome will do something about it, all while Rome, and her attitude toward power and authority is the problem.

Your Pope has plenipotentiary powers of discipline, which he failed to exercise. how many lapses have resulted in church censure over the millennia? What about even over the past century? How about the exercise of rigid Papal discipline over the responsible clerics in the Vatican bank scandal? How many Catholic Germans were excommunicated over their activities during the second world war?

For whatever reason, Rome has chosen, in order to preserve institutional power, to practice a form of moral inversion - where the powerful and the connected are rewarded for their "service" by a lack of censure for heinous activities.

How many mobsters have been excommunicated, and how many priests and bishops happily show up at the events of a crime family with greasy smiles and outstretched palms?

The climate of institutional control that conservative and traditional Catholics worship

Sorry, wrong religion. We worship God, not "climates". I'm sure you can find some neo-pagans out there who worship climates.

The Churches of the East booted you out over it

Huh? Out of what did they "boot us," and when did this "booting" take place?

How many mobsters have been excommunicated

Most mobsters are guilty of sins which render them unable to receive the Eucharist anyway, not that mobsters outside of the movies actually spend much time in church. Excommunicating them would accomplish nothing. You might as well excommunicate Saddam Hussein, for all the good it will do you.

Okay, you want to know? Just remember: you asked.

The Churches of the East booted you out over it, - politcal power struggle/split. We weren't booted: it was a full-scale split.

the Protestant Reformation occurred over it, - power struggle/I didn't get my way so I'm leaving (resuling in excommunication) split. By a bunch of people who thought they were smarter than they were.

and you guys have never learned the lesson.

Oh, we learned a lesson alright - don't argue with the ignorant until they learn what they are talking about. Otherwise, it's fruitless.

There you sit, wringing your hands and whimpering in the hope that Rome will do something about it, all while Rome, and her attitude toward power and authority is the problem.

Not quite. Rome knows the problem - they want the bishops to fix it themselves (or they're waiting for the liberals to die off). We're waiting for Rome to realize that they won't do it.

How about the exercise of rigid Papal discipline over the responsible clerics in the Vatican bank scandal?

Uh, well, it did result in the assasination of the previous pope.... It was fixed. It just took a little longer.

How many Catholic Germans were excommunicated over their activities during the second world war?

You mean the ones in the German Army? Because many Catholics were more in the Oscar Schindler catagory, according to people I know who lived through it.

For whatever reason, Rome has chosen, in order to preserve institutional power, to practice a form of moral inversion - where the powerful and the connected are rewarded for their "service" by a lack of censure for heinous activities.

It does tick off the faithful, but there are signs that it might be changing.

How many mobsters have been excommunicated,

I don't know about excommunicated - they don't do that kind of crime - but they are refused a Catholic burial. There is a whole cemetary in New York just for them. St. John somebody.

bishops happily show up at the events of a crime family with greasy smiles and outstretched palms?

You've been watching too much Godfather.

For whatever reason, Rome has chosen, in order to preserve institutional power, to practice a form of moral inversion - where the powerful and the connected are rewarded for their "service" by a lack of censure for heinous activities.

Two words--Frank Sinatra. Frank got to have a big wedding in the Cathedral, even though he had left his first wife (married in the Church) and his four kids; divorced and married several times in between; and then was granted annulments, etc. to pave the way for his last marriage.

I wonder how much Frankie paid the Cardinal for that deal?

When we burn 'em at the stake, they complain. When we apply the thumbscrews, they complain. When we stretch them on the rack, they complain. When we don't do any of those things, they STILL complain. We just can't satisfy those who refuse to be satisfied. ROFLMAO!!!