HAITIANS AND THE FREE STATE PROJECT

SierraTimes.com ^ | Nov. 1, 2002 | J.J. Johnson

[madfly]

It began Wednesday morning, when I found myself totally obsessed with the Free State Project. This is the proposal to move a large number of right-thinking people to one state, and influence the politics of an entire state. Sure, I had heard about it before, but it lead to me spending most of the day trying to figure out why my mind had made such a mental shift and focus so suddenly. Then it dawned on me: Haitian Refugees.

Let me explain.

Before this comes back at me for some reason, I'd better first state that I do not speak for the Free State Project, I am giving my own opinion of the matter - and this whole mess. You'll see why I said that as you read this.

Back to the Boat People.

Last time I checked, we were at war. Part of that war means protection of our borders, among the most glaring issues this political season that few, if any, politicians on either side want to touch. For a review: People cross the border as if this nation doesn't really have one. Among them were a few Jihad freaks, they take a few flying lessons, steal a few planes, and conduct what historians may call one of the most successful military strikes in world history. Hence, on Sept. 12, 2001, issues such as immigration and border security became important, nonpartisan (priority) issues. Pretty good reason to rally around the ol' flag, huh?

Then I remembered Florida - from hanging chads to a paramilitary siege of Miami for one poor kid whose mother died just to get him away from Cuba. One would assume that while one man is working to protect the nation's borders, his brother would follow his lead, or at least remind him over dinner, "hey, we gotta lot of border to protect here, too". And no, I'm not picking on the Bush family.

And so, with all things these days being part of the "new normal" I, the common schlep, would assume 220 folks would not be able to simply dock their boat right off Hwy. 1 on Hobie Beach, then storm said beach asking for a ride to - who knows - the voter registration office?

The images are still vivid in my mind. 220 ILLEGAL TRESPASSERS (not 'migrants', not 'immigrants') jumping out of a stuffed boat, swimming to shore, and STOPPING traffic on a major artery in Southern Florida. If this alone doesn't bother you, imagine these 220 folks having AK-47's shooting on their way in. The way our wonderful new attitude toward 'homeland security' is down there, we could safely assume they'd have taken Ft. Lauderdale by now.

But here's what's worse: I decided to check to see if anyone just might be a little outraged about what happened. And yes, they were:

About 200 protesters, most of them Haitian Americans, gathered outside the Liberty City Learning Center where Jeb Bush had a previously scheduled campaign appearance on Wednesday. The group, divided into partisan camps, clashed over what should be done with the new refugees (read: illegal trespassers).

U.S. Rep Carrie Meek, D-Miami, called on the governor (Jeb) to lobby his brother (W) to issue an executive order to allow the new Haitians, as well as other migrants (read: illegal trespassers) who have been held at Krome for many months, to be released.

On the other side:

Bush partisans among the protesters blamed Haitian President Jean-Bertrand Aristide and the island's political and economic turmoil for driving more than 200 Haitians to take an 8-day voyage aboard a rickety boat.

Meanwhile, a Haitian government official blamed an aid freeze by foreign donor countries (read: U.S. welfare payments) for causing the poverty in his country that led more than 200 migrants to travel in an overcrowded freighter to the United States.

Miami Herald - 10.30.02

Okay, call me crazy, but the last time I checked, we had troops in Haiti to deal with whatever the problem is there, including installing our own little 'puppet' (Aristide) to run this place. Here's a few more recent ILLEGAL ENCROACHMENTS:

. In May 1998, about 150 Haitians hidden aboard a wooden freighter jumped ship at a Miami River pier in broad daylight, diving into the water, hopping into waiting cars or taking off on foot. About 75 Haitians, including women and children, were detained.

. On New Year's Day 2000, a wooden boat treacherously overloaded with 406 Haitian, Dominican and Chinese trespassers were intercepted about eight miles off Key Biscayne.

. On Dec. 3, 2001, in a rare move, the U.S. Coast Guard brought to shore 185 Haitian trespassers, including 14 children. They were found just south of Elliott Key in a dangerously overcrowded 31-foot sailboat that also was in danger of capsizing.

Lovely.

But of course, this is our fault that these folks are coming here, right?

Answer: Correct - it is our fault, and here's why:

(Just my humble opinion) When a county KNOWS people meaning to do harm are attempting to cross a sovereign border illegally, the correct approach to take is:

1. Have the Coast Guard notify the captain of the boat that they are approaching sovereign waters, and they must halt to be
boarded or turn their vessel around immediately - outside the boundary (in this case - 12 miles from the coastline)

2. If the vessel continues to approach, have one missile (fired by either ship or air) detonate about 50 yards in front of said vessel
with the words "last warning" to follow.

3. If vessel persists, aim for the midsection of said vessel with similar missile, document results.

4. Send copies of documented results to local media and shipping docks in country where vessel is registered.

Sound harsh? Illegal attempts to dock on U.S. soil would stop in short order. But alas, none of this happened - for a nation at war.

So I woke up Wednesday morning, expecting to see the President announcing which Coast Guard officials were FIRED for allowing a boat to dock that close to a major metropolitan area. But no, let's hold them, feed them, protest about them, then interview them to see if they're being politically persecuted (in a country that we run), to see if they are worthy of staying - and maybe get flying lessons (after all, this is Florida) - or maybe just vanishing...

Stupid Question: If they ARE subject to political persecution in a country that we run, would it not be safe to assume that they just 'may' be upset with US?

Let me get to the point. We don't HAVE any homeland security, and our national security as a whole - sucks. While every other country seeks to protect their history, we seemed to be hell bent on forgetting who we are. We refuse to deal with a clear and present danger in favor of racially profiling white people when looking for a jihad sniper. We willfully send our manufacturing overseas, while doing everything in our power to kill our natural resource industry. We send federal agents into libraries to interrogate librarians about certain books - and the people who read them. We are losing the support and cooperation of more friendly nations each day, and, while those from every third world country try to encroach upon unprotected borders, good people are doing everything they can just to get away from all this madness.

And frankly, I'd like to join them.

Since a good portion of "we Americans" learned a hard lesson from the attempt to formally leave the union about 137 years ago, the best thing right-minded Americans can hope to do is work to form their own community elsewhere - somewhere. With all the flag waving, too few people see the obvious: This nation is sick, if not dying altogether. And I don't see any amount of patriotism, or voting democrat or republican solving this problem. I wish I could think more positively about it, but I can't. I see the fall of Modern Rome happening faster than the destruction of Social Security - about the only thing politicians seems interested in protecting. This nation - this place - has become a corporation whose only purpose is to keeping the ruling parties in power.

Sorry - just calling it as I see it.

Honestly, it has become increasing difficult to write about anything going on in this country anymore. What sense is there in talking about what's wrong when it will probably only get worse. Just when it seems things couldn't get worse, they devolve to a new epitome in less than a week. Even saying, "To heck with it, I'm leaving", can't stop the Internal Revenue Service from stealing nearly everything, even if you die.

Wonderful.

Maybe I'm just depressed. Maybe I'm tired of the complete futility of holding up this broken down system known as the United States of America. I know this: I want to go far away - check that - I want to go HOME. I want to be free. I want to live each day not having to look over my shoulder, wondering what Washington is going to throw at me next. It would be nice - it would be so nice, to have my personal liberty protected by another entity. Perhaps a state; where medical records remain private, where I can keep what I earn, defend myself against a threat - a STATE where I can live FREE.

Am I asking for too much?

Please do not accuse me of being an America hater, or unpatriotic. There are great things, and great people here. But most of these same great people all know what I know. Watching the media each day is merely more evidence that there we have some screws loose somewhere. And it is beyond time for the Real Americans of this nation to regroup (or in this case - group) ourselves together in a last ditch effort to rebuild a more perfect union.

[Reaganwuzthebest]

Everything Bush has said and done leads me to believe just the opposite.

We'll know just where Bush wants to go with this when he names Ziglar's replacement. If it's another beltway "moderate" with no law enforcement experience than it's safe to say Tancredo will be picking up quite a bit more support in the next few years.

[WRhine]

We'll know just where Bush wants to go with this when he names Ziglar's replacement. If it's another beltway "moderate" with no law enforcement experience than it's safe to say Tancredo will be picking up quite a bit more support in the next few years.

Yes, that is the real litmus test and "MOMENT OF TRUTH" that will signal if Bush is finally going to get serious about illegal immigration. And I'm not optimistic that the replacement will be anything but a warmed over version of James "Open Borders" Ziglar.

[4Freedom]

My money's on Bush putting a Hispanic RINO in charge of the INS.

That's how I envision him dealing with illegal immigration based on what he's done, so far.

[Reaganwuzthebest]

One thing to look for, will the new guy come in and immediately start enforcing the law at the employer level, or will he go to Congress and ask to form a committee or two in order to come up with solutions?

[WRhine]

One thing to look for, will the new guy come in and immediately start enforcing the law at the employer level, or will he go to Congress and ask to form a committee or two in order to come up with solutions?

You mean a committee that will forever study the problem of illegal immigration, generate tons of position papers and do nothing constructive? I'd put my money on that. It would create the illusion that something is being done while the invasion continues unchecked. Really, I just can't imagine Bush installing a no nonsense experienced law enforcement guy that is committed to making fundamental positive changes in the INS and wants to enforce our immigration laws. Wouldn't be prudent.

[WRhine]

My money's on Bush putting a Hispanic RINO in charge of the INS.

Yes, we have to make sure the illegal aliens are properly represented and that they are getting their fair share of taxpayer financed services.

[calenel]

Terrorism: The perpetrators of terrorism are criminals according to international laws pertaining to the conduct of war. Every nation that claims to uphold international law must act to crush this menace to civilization. That being said, we cannot rely on ANY other nation to do what needs to be done. If they help out, great, and we appreciate it. If not then they can get out of the way or suffer the consequences. Order of priority: those that engage in terrorism against us including accomplices, then those that engage in terror against our allies, then all the rest - we'll set priorities when we get that far. War to the knife without quarter - the survival of our civilization is at stake.

Immigration: LEGAL immigration is not a problem IF you can demonstrate a working knowledge of the English language and of fundamental US law (Read: The Constitution) and pass a background check. Zero tolerance for illegal immigration. I would militarize the borders, even if I had to call up National Guard units for the short term. We have 1.4 million active duty military (or thereabouts) - I don't see why we can't put some of them permanently on the border along with other obvious measures. If all those illegals really want the American dream they should bring their resources with them - establish the Rule of Law and apply for statehood.

Taxes: There is a need for some taxes to pay for those things that the Constitution specifically designates to the federal government, such as the military. There are some things we as a people have CHOSEN to do with tax money. These latter items constitute luxuries, and as such should be the first to go during times of economic stress. Taxes in general are too high, and the tax system is far too complex. I think the tax system should be simplified to the point where anyone with basic math skills could do their own return (with obvious exceptions for unusual or extraordinary situations). Furthermore, our tax money is spent on things that we have no control over. I believe that we should have a direct say in how the bulk of our taxes are spent. This would amount to a tax referendum every year when you fill out your (simple, one page) tax return - just check off the boxes that say where you want your money to go. Say up to 10 boxes each representing 5% of your tax dollars. I like the flat tax and consider it both more fair and realisitcally implementable, but what I think is most fair is a 'head tax' where everybody pays exactly the same amount either in withholdings or through various types of community service. After all, we are all getting the same benefits or at least access to them, (theoretically, anyway). Why shouldn't the price of admission be the same for everyone? I realize a 'head tax' is not feasible, at least for now. Finally, regardless of the form of taxation (progressive, flat, head, any combination) all laws that impose taxes should sunset after, say, 5 years. Then, if there really is a good reason for the tax and if the money is being used well, then they can reintroduce the bill (not extend - introduce a new bill even if it is exactly like the last one), duke it out in the legislature, and get it signed into law. As things stand now, politicians don't have to justify the indefinite duration of a tax, they can micro-tax us to death (impose incremental taxes that people don't really notice), and even if you get rid of the politicians, the next set don't have to do anything about it and the tax doesn't go away.

So, blam, are you going to vote for me in 2004? If so, you had better move to NH by then. In the mean time, I intend to support Republicans since, at least until I get to do something about it, that is the most likely chance of still having a country.

[watcher1]

I want to go HOME. I want to be free.

I'm going with the FSP

Who's coming with me?

[blam]

Sure, you get my vote with a few modifications:

Terrorism: Looks reasonable

Immigration: An immediate suspension of immigration for a period of thirty years.

Taxes: All taxes will sunset every four years and be re-voted on every four years during the presidential election. Each year as each person pays his/her taxes, they are issued a voting permit. Those without a permit will not be allowed to vote. (Four permits are required to vote in four year elections) Those who do not pay taxes (for what-ever-reason) will not be allowed to vote.

Government Service: Every American at reaching the age of eighteen must begin serving two years (minimum) duty in the military or other appropriate government service. (This two year service will fall under the code of UCMJ)

[varon]

. No one disagreed. I doubt, however, that those in charge have the b@lls to do this

Well, the AG of the former administration had the b@lls to incinerate American men, women and children and didn't give a damn what anyone thought. Perhaps we should get J. R. to come back and handle the infiltrators.

[AAABEST]

The FSP is not sucession by any means. It's just a bunch of like minded people moving to a state where freedom is still possible.

[AAABEST]

I want to go HOME. I want to be free. I'm going with the FSP. Who's coming with me?

I've been talking with my family about it. Watching what's happening to my country is becoming unsufferable.

I'll certainly commit when I get enough people on board. The more I think about this idea the more I absolutely love it. I'm going to have kids soon and I want some hope for them not to have to spend their lives in a socialist s***hole.

[E.G.C.]

BTTT!!!!!!

[Landru]

"Meanwhile, a Haitian government official blamed an aid freeze by foreign donor countries (read: U.S. welfare payments) for causing the poverty in his country that led more than 200 migrants to travel in an overcrowded freighter to the United States."

Yea-yea; SOS.

...different day.

[gcruse]

bttt 4 fsp

[Carry_Okie]

LOL! But why should the FSP be weenies chasing after a small prize like Idaho or Wyoming? Couldn't we make the FSP California? Most of the non-Mexican immigrants know enough of tyranny they'd join us in a minute, especially the Vietnamese. It really wouldn't take that many people and once done we'd have the resorce and economic base to help make us rich enough to propagate freedom around the world.

The Switzerland of the West! Besides, why not go for the good real estate? We've already got Hollywood on the run and San Francisco is geographically small enough we might just be able to tent it! A little methyl bromide and my summer home at Pacific and Divisadero would be fully fumigated!

It's not as hard as one might think to get rid of the freeloaders. Just start a Socialist State Project somewhere else and the bums will run to it like flies to feces! Might I suggest Oregon? They're already nine tenths of the way there and I am sure the voters are willing! It would make a nice contrast.

I can dream, can't I?

[Landru]

"I've been talking with my family about it. Watching what's happening to my country is becoming unsufferable."

I realize it's somewhat hollow to say this; but, nevertheless, here it goes, anyway.
Would you find any consolation in knowing you're not alone in your sentiments?
Because you're certainly not.

"I'll certainly commit when I get enough people on board. The more I think about this idea the more I absolutely love it."

Back when the Berlin Wall came down?
I suggested to my wife that, given the desperate condition those new countries & the people living there were in?
Insofar as while they were desperately trying to be free (ie capitalist free-market economy, elected representatives et al)?
Those people didn't have a clue, did not know how to be free, either.

Suggested we just might find the *kind* of life we were promised & frankly are not getting (here);or, at least find the opportunity to build one & without the incredible bullshit-resistance we seem to be getting from our own countrymen.

She then mentioned the bitter irony of our returning to the eastern european countries our grandfather's origin; after, they risked life & limb to flee & for the exact same reason(s) we're now once again considering leaving.
More than a hundred years later; history repeats.

Needless to say, our's was only a dream; as, we're well aware of the corruption & madness which has overcome those newly created Republics.
Hell's Bells, even what's happening in the european WASP nations is a crying shame as well as a disgusting, pathetic Socialist mess.

As for inhabiting a >>state<< somewhere from among our existing states?
One populated "by" like-minded people of the "conservative" mindset?
On the face it sounds idealic.
However...

Another -- wise -- poster has already mentioned what happened the last time such a thing was attempted.
Because seriously & as sure as God made little green apples?
If such a thing came to pass, penultimately Washington would interfere to the point the place we'd created, would be unbearable, unliveable, not what we'd wanted in any shape or form.
Then, ultimately, they'd send in their goons to destroy each & every individual who dared resist their meddling ways.

No.
IF THIS WERE TO BE REALISTICALLY CARRIED OUT?
It'd have to be done as a mass-migration to a smaller, third-world nation; whereby, by virtue of our numbers & the resources we'd brought with, we'd simply take over.

I had neighbors whose daughter & son-in-law were going to -- of all places -- Belize with the idea of doing exactly what I suggested above.
I have absolutely no idea whatever became of those two, either; as, we've long since moved away from their parents.

...fwiw & fyi; both those people were stalwart Libertarians.

[blackie]

Close Our Borders To All Illegals !!

Return All Illegals To Their Country Of Origin !!

Up With The Right !!

Vote For Republicans !!

GWB Is The Man !!

Death To all Muslim Extremist's !!

The RATS Are In Disarray...Eradicate The Rodents !!

Fire Democrats, Hire Republicans !!

Freedom Is Worth Fighting For !!

Let's Roll !!

Molon Labe !!

[archy]

The big question, of course, is in which state to begin?. It'll require a governor and legislature willing to stand up to federal blackmail and extortion, and both voter blocs and an armed populace willing to resist attempts to flood the area with illegal voters, probably foreign.

But the time to try it is now, while we still can. The window of opportunity will close soon.

-archy-/-

[facedown]

Bump