When Doctors Say Don't and the Patient Says Do

NYTimes ^ | 10/29/02 | MARC SIEGEL

[Just another Joe]

Sometimes you have to be firm with your doctor and TELL them what you want done, or not done.
If it becomes a problem you may want to find a different doctor.

[goodnesswins]

YUP....what we need are more "bad" patients - patients who question, cajole doctors......they are the healthiest people.

[Freedom2specul8]

That is really awesome... What an inspiration.

[Mark Felton]

Doctors must be managed.

[Dick Vomer]

as long as she understood the risk and was willing to take it.....fine...if she got infected, paralyzed, died......
well then the family would of course would not have invited him to the recital but I'm sure would have invited him to a Morbidity and Mortality conference, followed by a really cool deposition, and then some really, really, really neat meeting with the medical staff review committees and finally arbitration or trial..

I love stories like this. Cause we all know that doctors are dumba$$3@ that only want your money.

the fact is that the doctor took the risk WITH the patient. She seemed competent and should have been allowed the surgery, but I think he got very lucky.... and the patient had a good outcome.. congrats to the patient and kudos to the surgeon.

[redhead]

It is VERY important for people to TAKE RESPONSIBILITY FOR THEIR HEALTH, and not hand it off to a near-stranger. Today, many people have the idea that the medical industry has their best interests at heart, just as the believe that the talking heads on the alphabet-soup networks are telling the truth. Some doctors are trained to treat SYMPTOMS. They specialize in interpreting test results and writing prescriptions.

[Paradox]

Lets say that this had ended up badly, which, statistically speaking, for a 90 year old, is probably what would have happened. These doctors would have had their pants sued off.

I am all for patients taking responsibility for their own care, but they also need to take responsibility for their decisions as well. Of course, when there are lawyers involved....

[Just another Joe]

What do you want to bet that the patient was required to sign a waver?

[Paradox]

A waiver?

"Members of the Jury, my client, a frail 90 year old woman, was not of sound mind when she signed that waiver. How many 90 year olds would YOU trust with your life?"

[Hildy]

What if you TELL your Dr. you would rather die, what then? I believe in euthenasia. Sue me.

[Hatteras]

Doctor: Does it hurt when you do this?

Me: Yes.

Doctor: Then don't do that.

[Just another Joe]

What if you TELL your Dr. you would rather die, what then?

I don't know about anyone else but I don't need a doctor for that.

[Just another Joe]

How many 90 year olds would YOU trust with your life?"

Practically every one of them that I know that are not living in a 'retirement' home.
The question should be, "How many 90 year olds would YOU trust with their OWN life?"

[Amore]

Paradox is quite right. A waiver is barely worth the paper it is printed on.

[acnielsen guy]

That is just what the doctor in Spain said to me - I said, "it hurts when I bend down." He said,"don´t bend down."

I think that is a universal doctor joke.

[Mark Felton]

" if the surgeon refuses she can shop around. Problem is, govermental health care has taken price competition out of the equation. You get the same fee if you operate on a 90 with multiple co-morbidites or a healthy 30 year old."

I agree. That is what I mean by "manage". Hire them and fire them if need be.

I don't know why I would let one man assume responsibility for my health when I would not fully trust one man to care for my car.

It takes interaction. It requires education on the part of the patient and questions from the patient. I can understand a doctor who says he "does not know" or once to try something different (because a previous course of treatment did not work) but I cannot stand a doctor who will get defensive when I ask questions.

[Mark Felton]

"once" = wants (hhhmmm...still having brain cramps mebbe I need a new doctor)

[joonbug]

And if things don't turn out as well as the insistent patient expects, hire a lawyer and sue the doctor. With these controversial cases, it won't be hard to find a plaintif's expert to say that the surgery was not indicated.