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Kostunica Vows to Bring Down Serbia
AP Online | 10-14-2 | By DUSAN STOJANOVIC

Posted on 10/14/2002 1:52:02 PM PDT by Whitebread

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To: kosta50
about the extreme reading... well, I enjoy reading your posts and most often agree with points you present.
81 posted on 10/16/2002 7:17:20 PM PDT by Tamodaleko
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To: Tamodaleko; kosta50; Banat
The latest chance Serbs had to advance their position in Balkans was at the fall of communism. They blew it by putting everything they have on a wrong horse - commie Slobo

been visiting the IWPR site again ? Please try a dose of fact base reality for once rather than HumWarrior agit-prop.......

reality is that SPS never got a majority of the votes in Serbia, the typical SPS percentage was on order of 40%........in election after election a majority of "the serbs" did NOT support the SPS

The SPS always governed in a coalition. At virtually any time during the 1990's, the SPS (and your bogeyman Milosevic) could have been kicked out of power simply by having the anti-SPS parties form a majority coalition.

The anti-SPS parties were too busy engaging in childish squabbles to ever get serious about governing.

The anti-SPS parties only got toegther after Albright read them the riot act in the Summer of 2000 and gave them 'suitcases of cash' estimated at $100mm. Albright's offer of serious loot focused their minds wonderfully.....

and now that Albright isn't sending suitcases of cash to the anti-SPS leaders they are back to their childish bickering...

.........which means that a SPS/SRS/Unity coalition is very likely to build a majority coalition in the next parliment............and the bickering DOS amatuers will return to their teaching jobs.

82 posted on 10/16/2002 7:20:36 PM PDT by vooch
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To: Hoplite
My take is that it's a mess, that constitutional reform is in order to remove the 50% stipulation, and that if Djindjic stands in the way of this, he's going to find his Western support evaporating.

has there ever been a time in which you disagreed with the NPR/PBS POV ?

83 posted on 10/16/2002 7:22:33 PM PDT by vooch
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To: vooch; kosta50
I agree 100% vooch, and yes very possible.
Anti-SPS arrived late and artificially to the scene and I don't think they would have changed much for the Serbian question. This makes me blame Slobo even more... but I'll cut it off right now, otherwise I'll have Kosta on my back again.
84 posted on 10/16/2002 8:03:19 PM PDT by Tamodaleko
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To: vooch; kosta50
Perhaps if the founders of the original Democratic party (Kosta Chavoshky, Voyislav Koshtunitsa and Leon Cohen) in summer 1989 could have lured Dobritsa Chosich... sigh
85 posted on 10/16/2002 8:27:01 PM PDT by Tamodaleko
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To: Tamodaleko
Turks brought the Jews in Balkans

I thought most of the early Jewish settlements came from those poor souls kicked out of Spain, the Sephardim.

Had it not been for Serbs, Broz would have never made it more than a schlosser

The communist party had no official chapter in Serbia. Tito never even thought the Serbs would be anything other than an obstacle to a communist revolution.

Had it not been for the Nazis invading Yugoslavia, because the Serbs staged mass demostrations against a non-aggression pact between Yugoslavia and Germany, followed by a coup and annullment of the pact, Tito would have indeed remained in Zagreb, sharing office space next to Ustasha's HQ.

But once Germany attacked, the "stupid" Serbs fought back. Serbs were fed communist propaganda about being the chauvinist opressors, about enslaving other nations, everything to make one feel just awful being a Serb. The only "good" Serbs were those who hated other Serbs with more passion than non-Serbs could ever match.

At Bujan, Kosovo was not promised to Albania by the "Serbs," but by Serb communists. Serb communists have done everything to hurt their nation, and they had almost half a century to serve two extreme serbophobes: Tito and Kardelj. Slobo was the first real "aberration," among Serb communists in that he was more a Serb than a communist.

The entire history of Yugoslavia, since the Serbs helped Tito establish a more "equitable" and "just" union not dominated by Serbs, the country has been slowly moving towards diminishing everything Serbian. The Serbian people had no input. The Serbs did not produce the 1974 constitution either. Serb communists were passive lackeys, nothing more. So, to say it was all the "Serbs'" fault it's like blaming the Jews for everything.

I am sorry that you see it that way Tamodaleko. It is somewhat disappointing, but that's your opinion.

86 posted on 10/16/2002 8:32:42 PM PDT by kosta50
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To: Hoplite
if Djindjic stands in the way of this, he's going to find his Western support evaporating

I think Djindjich will dance the way he is told to. So if that means going along with the reform of the 50% rule, he will agree.

87 posted on 10/16/2002 8:36:03 PM PDT by kosta50
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To: Tamodaleko
This makes me blame Slobo even more... but I'll cut it off right now, otherwise I'll have Kosta on my back again

Tamodaleko, if you don't want me to speak my mind I will never, ever, respond to your posts. Is that what you want? I am not telling you to stop. You have your opinion, and I find it disappointing that you can blame one factor for everything, that's your right. Mine is not to change your mind, but to appeal to your reason.

If I disagree with you, with Hoplite, with Tropoljac, whoever, it's not personal and it's an honest disagreement, in good faith. If you want a Yes-Forum, I guess this is not it.

88 posted on 10/16/2002 8:44:11 PM PDT by kosta50
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To: kosta50
>>>>>I thought most of the early Jewish settlements came from those poor souls kicked out of Spain, the Sephardim.<<<<<
Yes, and the Ottoman empire helped them migrate to the Balkans.
89 posted on 10/16/2002 8:46:20 PM PDT by Tamodaleko
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To: Tamodaleko
Yes, and the Ottoman empire helped them migrate to the Balkans

Why?

90 posted on 10/16/2002 8:49:41 PM PDT by kosta50
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To: kosta50
>>>>>Slobo was the first real "aberration," among Serb communists in that he was more a Serb than a communist.<<<<<

Right here is where the difference of opinion is.
91 posted on 10/16/2002 8:55:05 PM PDT by Tamodaleko
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To: kosta50
re:#90
administration. I recommend a book from Krinka Vidakovich-Petrov "The culture of spanish Jews in YU" written in serbo-croatian language" to find more details.
92 posted on 10/16/2002 9:00:53 PM PDT by Tamodaleko
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To: Tamodaleko
re:#92
Thank you for the source.
93 posted on 10/17/2002 3:30:54 AM PDT by kosta50
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To: kosta50
So if that means going along with the reform of the 50% rule, he will agree.

Whoever is in charge in Belgrade is going to be seen as dancing, Kosta - that's the way the nationalists (er, more nationalist than whoever is in charge) will paint it. Kostunica is merely doing to Djindjic what Seselj is going to do to Kostunica as soon as he gathers the reigns of power and has to start dealing with Western pressure.

94 posted on 10/17/2002 11:51:59 AM PDT by Hoplite
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Comment #95 Removed by Moderator

To: Tropoljac
We'll see, if it will be that funny.
96 posted on 10/17/2002 2:06:13 PM PDT by DestroyEraseImprove
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To: Tropoljac
I'm not saying Seselj will get into power - I think that enough people in Serbia know that he's a vicious clown and wouldn't allow his accession to power. (Granted, he won an invalidated election in 1997, but here's to hoping his recent showing is more to the point.)

What I am saying is that Seselj will continue to act the part of the hyena and bite at the heels of whoever is in charge, using the nationalist platform.

97 posted on 10/17/2002 4:52:58 PM PDT by Hoplite
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To: Tropoljac
I'm sorry this if this is off-topic, but I got pinged to this thread. And I'm interested in your take on the US bombing of the Backa Palanka Bridge (over the Dunov near Ilok) during the infamous 1999 NATO bombing campaign.

As far as I could see, that bridge had absolutely no military strategic value whatsoever. In fact, by bombing that bridge and declaring it a military target, NATO was either claiming that Croatia would permit FRY forces to transit Croatia (from where to where, hello?) to slaughter "poor KLA" or they were concerned FRY forces would invade Croatia over that bridge at Ilok (another hello? hello? Earth to Jamie!). Both are totally insane propositions, of course. Just wondered what your thoughts were.

I know I may be a bit sentimental about this bridge, but I simply cannot see any military strategic importance, unless on is a madman. I'm curious what the Croat perspective is. Thanks in advance for your reply.

[Note to others not familiar with the geography: this bridge spanned the Danube between Serbia and Croatia. In fact, it was the was the last remaining bridge over the Danube between the two countries and a vital trade link.]

98 posted on 10/18/2002 8:27:21 PM PDT by wonders
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To: Hoplite; Tropoljac
Whoever is in charge in Belgrade is going to be seen as dancing

I understand what you are saying. I also think that once in power every politician moderates to some extent, or at least takes any stance that will keep him in power.

The aim is to stay in power, whatever it takes. For that reason, I think even Sheshel would moderate his "rabid nationalism" to assure he stays in power.

However, the more extreme the situation is the more extreme the politicians will be. I think Sheshel won the 1997 annulled elections simply because the electorate was willing to change the regime, so even Sheshel (more extreme than Miloshevich) became the choice. One more reason to keep Koshtunitsa around.

99 posted on 10/19/2002 12:48:55 AM PDT by kosta50
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To: kosta50
I am curious when will the model democracies of the West, especially the US, nominate a Jew for their head of state?

The late nineteenth century. And he wasn't just nominated, he went all the way to the top. Well, technically Queen Victoria outranked Disraeli, but the PM actually runs things.

100 posted on 10/19/2002 1:05:26 AM PDT by A.J.Armitage
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