Rational Christian look at UFOs and Extraterrestrials.

The founder of Reasons to Believe presents a rational Christian look at UFOs and extraterrestrials.

Hugh Ross has a B.S, Physics, University of British Columbia; M.S. & Ph.D., Astronomy, University of Toronto.
Mr. Ross is the co-author of, Lights in the Sky & Little Green Men (NavPress, 2002)

Hugh has been stargazing since he was a young boy, and by the age of 17, he had become director of observations for the Royal Astronomical Society in Canada. As an astronomer, Hugh has logged thousands of observation time and has learned that science can and does address the possibility of life’s existence elsewhere in the universe. In the mid-'70s, Hugh was assigned the task of processing UFO reports at CalTech. At the same time, Hugh began an intense study of the Bible. "Secular society is gullible about the possibility that extraterrestrial life exists without having scientific evidence to prove it," says Hugh. "The motivation for this book is the need to communicate clear, satisfying explanations from scientific, theological, philosophical, and political standpoints."

Hugh says that he uses the scientific approach called "the process of elimination" to answer the question Is there a place where extraterrestrials could live in the universe? Over the years, science has made some significant advances. "The number of candidates for life sites within the Milky Way grows smaller each day," says Hugh. At one time, biologists speculated that extraterrestrial life forms might be based on exotic chemistry, not carbon as earthly life is. But today the conclusion is that all conceivable life forms must be carbon-based. And if life forms exist on other planets, they must be planets like Earth, orbiting a star like the sun in a galaxy like the Milky Way. "Ongoing research shows that this seems less possible as each year passes," says Hugh.

Most people think UFOs are physical. "But they can’t be physical," says Hugh, "because they defy gravity." While Hugh does not say that UFOs aren’t real, no physical object can move like UFOs have been reported to move. Respected UFOolgists agree that there must be something real at the bottom of some UFO reports. Residual UFOs (RUFOs) is a terminology that refers to the UFOs that are left over after all the others are explained away. There is quite a bit of evidence that UFOs are real, such as crash sites. There are over 1,000 sites where allegedly the UFOs have crashed. "The ground is depressed, the trees and grass are burnt," says Hugh. "In these scenarios, we are dealing with non-physical reality." What this evidence suggests is that RUFOs are capable of producing physical effects, such as burnt grass, but are not physical themselves.

Hugh says the Bible proclaims the existence of a personal Creator who can act independently outside the cosmos and who is not restricted by the four, large space-time dimensions (length, width, height or time). The Bible also describes the spirit realm (the realm beyond matter, energy and space-time dimensions) and declares the existence of God and two or more distinct creatures: humans and angels. Hugh explains that humans remain physically restricted to the dimensions of the cosmos and cannot account for the unexplained phenomena. Angels, or fallen angels, remain as possible links. Fallen angels, or demons, intent on distorting God’s authority and purpose, draw attention away from God and the gospel and are an identifiable source of explanation.

The conclusion that demons are behind the RUFOs phenomenon is testable. According to the Bible, demons attack only those individuals who invite the attacks. "All that is necessary to further prove the conclusion of demonic involvements," says Hugh, "is to continue surveying people to ascertain who has encounters with RUFOs and who does not." Researchers continue to observe a correlation between the degree of invitations in a person’s life to demonic attacks (séance, Ouija boards, astrology, witchcraft, palm or psychic reading). One reason why research scientists may be reluctant to say specifically that demons exist behind the RUFOs is because that answer points too directly to a Christian interpretation of the problem.

Reasons to Believe is an interdenominational ministry that communicates the basis for belief in the Bible as the true Word of God.
www.reasons.org

Gen 6:4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.

This verse has been twisted and squeezed everyway but to show the truth. It's so simple.

1 And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born unto them,

daughters in this general sense means unbelievers in God.

2 That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose.

sons of God here means believers in God

3 And the LORD said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years.

God was not happy when His people married unbelievers in Him

4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.

Giants as pointed out in your post has been translated many different ways but most of them are negative. This is where I've seen so many times that these "giants" where spirits when in context it only talks about humans not spirits.

There again is the Sons of God and daughters of men.

5 And GOD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil.

V 3d yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years.

Does 120 days ring a bell? How many years did it take Noah to build the Ark? 120 years. Noah is mentioned in V 6 and his story is then told.

There arn no spirit beings except for God mentioned in this section of Scriture.

I don't know what Zon posted, and I cannot answer for him.

Post #253:

Zon:Flying reindeer towing a fat man in a sleigh, an Easter bunny, tooth fairy and supernatural God. Such mysticism injected into innocent little minds striving to accurately identify reality in their formative years. Often looking up to their parents to confirm whether or not they have accurately identified reality. Those young innocent children betrayed in the name of fun and love. What causes such hideous child abuse? Mysticism: the number-one disease of the conscious mind.

Andy: You say it a lot better than I can.

But I never accused Christians in general of child abuse, your libel to the contrary notwithstanding.

Zon did and you high-fived him in post #253.

You're telling me that if you hadn't once read that God said "Thou shalt not kill," you'd be shooting people down on the streets? You really need God for that? That's sad.

No, I wouldn't, but a person that thinks that there isn't a higher power to answer to would more likely see no harm in it as Stalin and Hitler obviously proved.

Actually, if you look at it that way, then atheism really places a much higher value on human life. A good, solid Christian dies, and who cares? He or she'll just spend eternity eating pealed grapes inside the Pearly Gates. An atheist dies, and that's it. If you've lived your life well, great. If not, that's it - you've blown it. But there's nobody around to bail you out.

But the problem is that your atheists didn't pass the test, they murdered 60 million in the 20th century. You say that since atheists don't murder people that their better than Christians because God holds Christians back, but atheists set records for murder in the 20th century so it appears atheists aren't better than Christians.

Hitler wasn't an atheist.

Hitler used Catholicism like Clinton used his preachers for photo ops. Have you forgotten the bible burning in Germany?

What are you talking about? Who the heck portrayed themselves as "Godly" during the Thirty Years War?

People who fool people into believing they're godly and then commence to steal and murder are were using the fact that the populace couldn't read the bible for themselves to not fall into their trap. When literacy expanded, the people that were murdering in the name of God lost their power. Since then it's been mostly atheists that have committed massive amounts of genocide.

Um, no. Stalinists support Stalin. Atheism isn't a political philosophy.

Athism has been an intregral part of communism. Tens of millions have died because of it.

Which explains how Christian Europe has been such a pacific paradise the last five hundred years?

Those wars were fought for power, not religion. Atheists love power. It's all they have to live for.

I gave five example, not three. Interesting that you only mention three of the five examples given. The five examples are (1) God (2) Allah (3) flying Santa Clause (4) Easter bunny (5) tooth fairy. I do make prominent note that you didn't include Allah in the three examples.

Muslims are a bit confused at the moment. God promised Ishmael he'll have a place in the millenium.

Presumably since you didn't mention Allah in your three examples of non-existent mind-spun fabrications you believe Allah exists. Or is it the tooth fairy or Easter bunny that you believe exists?

Like I said, muslims are a bit confused. Some beleive God is a woman too. They're confused also. Just because they've got a few details wrong doesn't mean that the entity doesn't exist.

I challenge you to back up that claim with fact.

So you don't think Christianity is mysticism?

I never said anything of the sort about Christians. So either back up your claim with facts or admit your error and correct it.

Christianity is more than mysticism in your view? You don't include Christians in your accusations of post #251?

daughters in this general sense means unbelievers in God.

I disagree. Later in the bible, God tells women to keep their hair long because of the angels. The hair is a parable for the teachings of Christ. If women will keep the teachings of Christ as a cover, they will not be seduced by the angels.

1Cr 11:15 But if a woman have long hair, it is a glory to her: for [her] hair is given her for a covering.

Obviously, her hair is not to cover her private body parts, so this covering is to cover against the angels.

1Cr 11:10 For this cause ought the woman to have power on [her] head because of the angels.

1Cr 11:3 But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman [is] the man; and the head of Christ [is] God.

So God covers Christ who covers man who convers woman because of the angels (fallen angels). Why would this be necessary? Because they want to make more nefilim.

sons of God here means believers in God

I disagree. The verse you quoted said their were giants in the earth when the sons of God came unto the daughters of men. Then we have this:

Jos 13:12 All the kingdom of Og in Bashan, which reigned in Ashtaroth and in Edrei, who remained of the remnant of the giants: for these did Moses smite, and cast them out.

So there was only a remnant of giants left here. Then that means that the giants aren't offspring of believers, but special, and were wiped out. If giants were the offspring of believers then there would be giants today.

God was not happy when His people married unbelievers in Him

He was not happy about the nefilim.

4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown. Giants as pointed out in your post has been translated many different ways but most of them are negative. This is where I've seen so many times that these "giants" where spirits when in context it only talks about humans not spirits.

Offspring of women and angels.

There again is the Sons of God and daughters of men. 5 And GOD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil. V 3d yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years. Does 120 days ring a bell? How many years did it take Noah to build the Ark? 120 years. Noah is mentioned in V 6 and his story is then told. There arn no spirit beings except for God mentioned in this section of Scriture.

I think the covering issue proves that the angels are after women. They're after them to make more nefilim.

Post #251 included the worship of a supernatural God as mysticism. You endorsed it in post #253.

You're not making much sense. Brainwashing your kid by filling his mind with nonsense is one thing, but child abuse? I take parental abuse of children very seriously. I would not accuse somewhat of it lightly, nor would I endorse the comments of someone who did.

Zon made what I consider to be an important point in that comparison. You have a choice: you can either read what we're posting and try to maintain a civil dialogue, or you can create your strawmen and accuse me of being a closet Stalinist. I assure you the latter does not bode well for this thread.

You're not making much sense. Brainwashing your kid by filling his mind with nonsense is one thing, but child abuse?

Zon called it child abuse in post #251. You endorsed Zon's statement in post #253. Here is your post #253:

------------------------------------

To: Zon

[Zon]Flying reindeer towing a fat man in a sleigh, an Easter bunny, tooth fairy and supernatural God. Such mysticism injected into innocent little minds striving to accurately identify reality in their formative years. Often looking up to their parents to confirm whether or not they have accurately identified reality. Those young innocent children betrayed in the name of fun and love. What causes such hideous child abuse? Mysticism: the number-one disease of the conscious mind.

[Andy Card]You say it a lot better than I can.

253 posted on 10/12/02 10:17 PM Central by andy_card [ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 251 | View Replies | Report Abuse ]

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I take parental abuse of children very seriously. I would not accuse somewhat of it lightly, nor would I endorse the comments of someone who did.

You just did above.

Oh? You're going to have it deleted? You're getting your butt handed to you so you want to erase it? LOL

#3Fan: You say that Christians have a tendency toward child abuse. 272
Zon: I challenge you to back up that claim with fact. 279
#3Fan: So you don't think Christianity is mysticism?

Stop obfuscating and prove your claim that you made in your # 272 post by providing facts to back up your claim. Or, admit your error and correct it.

Zon: I never said anything of the sort about Christians. So either back up your claim with facts or admit your error and correct it. 279
#3Fan: Christianity is more than mysticism in your view? You don't include Christians in your accusations of post #251?

Either prove your claim that you made in your # 272 post by providing facts, or admit your error and correct it.

Zon: I can't speak for Andy_Card. 281
#3Fan: You did according to him. He endorsed your post #251

I speak only for myself. That any person may or may not agree with what I write, say or do is their choice of which I have no control over what other people do, say or write. No matter how low you stoop it will not change that fact.

#3Fan: Like it or not, Hitler and Stalin are very relevent to a atheist vs. Christion debate when the debate turns to crimes committed by each. Zon and Andy made the mistake of taking this argument in that direction and now they're getting nuked for it. 277
Zon: That's obvious. I speak for myself. I never brought Christians into the "debate", you injected Christians into the discussion. I never said anything about Christians. So either back up your claim with facts or admit your error and correct it. 281
#3Fan: So who's committing this child abuse? Witches?

You're still avoiding your responsibility to be honorable. Either prove your claim that you made in your #277 post by providing facts, or admit your error and correct it. When making errors, it is always the person that makes the error that benefits the most by correcting his or her own errors.

Andrew, my dear friend, Jesus--the Jesus that I serve is this life and will continue to in the next

You pretend to know what only God can? Isn't that blasphemy?

Jesus's love for you is like a fire.

Agreed. And in Christian theocracies it has a tendency to manifest itself physically, burning non-Christians alive at the stake.

He died for you.

Why? I didn't ask anybody to die for me, and I'm repelled at the prospect. You expect me to prostrate myself in gratitude? Think again.

Here you go Zon. I'll repost it for you.