Posted on 10/11/2002 6:10:44 AM PDT by apackof2
Scientific Approach
The founder of Reasons to Believe presents a rational Christian look at UFOs and extraterrestrials.
Hugh Ross has a B.S, Physics, University of British Columbia; M.S. & Ph.D., Astronomy, University of Toronto.
Mr. Ross is the co-author of, Lights in the Sky & Little Green Men (NavPress, 2002)
Hugh has been stargazing since he was a young boy, and by the age of 17, he had become director of observations for the Royal Astronomical Society in Canada. As an astronomer, Hugh has logged thousands of observation time and has learned that science can and does address the possibility of life’s existence elsewhere in the universe. In the mid-'70s, Hugh was assigned the task of processing UFO reports at CalTech. At the same time, Hugh began an intense study of the Bible. "Secular society is gullible about the possibility that extraterrestrial life exists without having scientific evidence to prove it," says Hugh. "The motivation for this book is the need to communicate clear, satisfying explanations from scientific, theological, philosophical, and political standpoints."
Hugh says that he uses the scientific approach called "the process of elimination" to answer the question Is there a place where extraterrestrials could live in the universe? Over the years, science has made some significant advances. "The number of candidates for life sites within the Milky Way grows smaller each day," says Hugh. At one time, biologists speculated that extraterrestrial life forms might be based on exotic chemistry, not carbon as earthly life is. But today the conclusion is that all conceivable life forms must be carbon-based. And if life forms exist on other planets, they must be planets like Earth, orbiting a star like the sun in a galaxy like the Milky Way. "Ongoing research shows that this seems less possible as each year passes," says Hugh.
Residual UFOs
Most people think UFOs are physical. "But they can’t be physical," says Hugh, "because they defy gravity." While Hugh does not say that UFOs aren’t real, no physical object can move like UFOs have been reported to move. Respected UFOolgists agree that there must be something real at the bottom of some UFO reports. Residual UFOs (RUFOs) is a terminology that refers to the UFOs that are left over after all the others are explained away. There is quite a bit of evidence that UFOs are real, such as crash sites. There are over 1,000 sites where allegedly the UFOs have crashed. "The ground is depressed, the trees and grass are burnt," says Hugh. "In these scenarios, we are dealing with non-physical reality." What this evidence suggests is that RUFOs are capable of producing physical effects, such as burnt grass, but are not physical themselves.
Hugh says the Bible proclaims the existence of a personal Creator who can act independently outside the cosmos and who is not restricted by the four, large space-time dimensions (length, width, height or time). The Bible also describes the spirit realm (the realm beyond matter, energy and space-time dimensions) and declares the existence of God and two or more distinct creatures: humans and angels. Hugh explains that humans remain physically restricted to the dimensions of the cosmos and cannot account for the unexplained phenomena. Angels, or fallen angels, remain as possible links. Fallen angels, or demons, intent on distorting God’s authority and purpose, draw attention away from God and the gospel and are an identifiable source of explanation.
The conclusion that demons are behind the RUFOs phenomenon is testable. According to the Bible, demons attack only those individuals who invite the attacks. "All that is necessary to further prove the conclusion of demonic involvements," says Hugh, "is to continue surveying people to ascertain who has encounters with RUFOs and who does not." Researchers continue to observe a correlation between the degree of invitations in a person’s life to demonic attacks (séance, Ouija boards, astrology, witchcraft, palm or psychic reading). One reason why research scientists may be reluctant to say specifically that demons exist behind the RUFOs is because that answer points too directly to a Christian interpretation of the problem.
Reasons to Believe is an interdenominational ministry that communicates the basis for belief in the Bible as the true Word of God.
www.reasons.org
Granted. But you wouldn't exactly expect to find the infallible Word of God chock full of scientific errata, logical inconsistencies, direct contradictions, historical inaccuracies, and other indications that God badly needed an editor.
Read about the fraud here, or here or read any of these following sources:
Brecher, K. "Sirius Enigmas" in Brecher, K. & Feirtag, M., eds. Astronomy of the Ancients. 1979, MIT Press.
Ortiz de Montellano, B. "The Dogon People Revisited" in Skeptical Inquirer, Nov/Dec. 1996, p. 39. Excellent up-to-date review.
Sagan, C. "White Dwarfs and Little Green Men" in Broca's Brain. 1979, Random House.
And then we'll have to face Hun Pic Tok, the Mayan War God of 9000 Knives. And remember: thou shalt have no gods before Hun Pic Tok.
Did the Ancient Egyptians erect massive Triangles to house the tombs of dead Pharaohs? Words have a purpose, dingleberry. They have clear and precise meanings.
Common sense tells us that the "sits upon the circle of the earth" represents a round earth. Not a flat earth.
No. Sitting upon the circle of the earth means exactly what it says - that someone's sitting on a flat, circular earth.
If according to your interpretation, it is a flat round earth that God is sitting on, then He would be sitting WITHIN a circle, NOT upon a circle.
Nonsense. I sit UPON a flat floor, NOT within it. I don't know what your first language is (your Spanish handle would tend to suggest that its Spanish), but your inability to comprehend the meaning of even the simplest English words and phrases has convinced me that it can't be English.
Either way your interpretation makes the verse read like nonsense.
You mean to tell me... {gasp} that the Bible is nonsense? Please, please, let it not be true!
Point 1......people act in their own self-interest because of sin, and sin is the result of disobedience to God.
Point 2.....A set of questions for you to ponder......how are we, as humans, able to distinguish right from wrong, if there is no higher power? Do we, in our own imaginations make up rules that are impossible to follow, because we are sinful out of our own human imaginations? Who made up the Bible, with it's miracles and commandments, love and atonement? Who was so clever as to understand the human condition and make up a solution that is beyond human understanding?
For example, how do we know that it is wrong to murder if we are using nothing but our own judgement? What makes anything wrong, if the only yardstick we use is our own opinion?
You claim that you are a right-winger, yet you use the exact argumentation the left uses to defend your own positions. Who are you to tell them that murdering their unborn babies is wrong? Where do you get that idea? From within yourself? Because if you do, why is your opinion any more right than theirs? If we all make up our own right and wrong, and there are no absolutes, then we are all just 'thinking we're right.'
You, in essence agree with the left wing......they make up their own rules, denying any good or evil greater than mankind.......and so do you.
OK. OK. I'm not trying to be obtuse or "intellectually dishonest" as you put it, but what you write above simply makes no sense to me.
Of course what I have said makes no sense to you, because it is the Gospel of Jesus Christ, and in a spiritual realm you refuse to acknowledge even exists.
It is more than obvious that you didn't understand what I said, because your response to it is arguing a point that was never made in the paragraph you quoted. The presence of evil has little to do with 'simple, observable public behaviors.' Satan works on the human heart. Public behavior is only a manifestation of what is going on inside a person's soul. For instance......Hillary Clinton would be just as evil, whether or not there were any public displays of that evil. Get it? Evil HAS a causal power in the being of Satan, but God, the Creator, has given us the freedom to follow His commandments, rather than to do what is evil.
The reason, once again, that you believe that I have not explained anything, is that you lack the ability to comprehend what was said.
As my final comment to you on this subject on this thread, I will say again, that the only way for you to begin to understand spiritual things is to go to the Source, through the reading of God's Word. Find a Bible, look up the Gospel of John, and begin reading. Read the epistles of Paul. Read the Psalms. See what's there.
This is not about my opinion. In fact, as a finite human being, I am not capable of coming up with these thoughts. This is not a case of "I think I'm right, you think you're right." This is about absolute truth, which exists whether you (or I) believe it or not. You are denying the laws of God, but the existence of absolute truth doesn't depend on your belief any more than the existence of the law of gravity depends on your belief.
If you walk out a 20 story window, you will fall and die, regardless of your belief system, or how much you think you're right.
If you live your life, and go to the grave without the laws and the love of God, and the grace that comes through Christ, you will also die.........for eternity.........no matter how right you thought you were.
May you someday understand the truth of these words.
Hugh, take a break right there.
Really.
No, you are not. I spoke to Him this morning and He does not like you.
For those that are so shallow that they need God to do magic tricks to prove His existence, prophesy is coming true.
I can't fathom seeking tricks or any thing from nothing. I think it's debilitating to a person who seeks that which doesn't exist in reality and only in their mind. Right up their with Santa Clause, an Easter Bunny and tooth fairy.
Flying reindeer towing a fat man in a sleigh, an Easter bunny, tooth fairy and supernatural God. Such mysticism injected into innocent little minds striving to accurately identify reality in their formative years. Often looking up to their parents to confirm whether or not they have accurately identified reality. Those young innocent children betrayed in the name of fun and love. What causes such hideous child abuse? Mysticism: the number-one disease of the conscious mind.
Dunno. Just some Hebrew-Babylonian folk myth. I'd ask Gilgamesh about them, next time you see him.
Will they come again?
They might stop by if they're in the neighborhood; it all depends on how hospitable their reception was the last time.
You say it a lot better than I can.
If people didn't act in their own self-interest, the human race would die out real fast. Why do we eat, drink, sleep, defecate, procreate, etc? Self-interest. There can (and should) be more to life than that, but life cannot continue to exist without any of those.
how are we, as humans, able to distinguish right from wrong, if there is no higher power?
I'm not sure, but we've done that nonetheless, by establishing the Rule of Law, ethical treatises, etc., none of which are derivative of the Bible.
Do we, in our own imaginations make up rules that are impossible to follow, because we are sinful out of our own human imaginations?
I don't understand that question. Why would anybody create a rule impossible to follow? Oh yes, to make perfectly ordinary people feel guilty unless they repent their "sins" [as defined by the local church] and tithe it.
Who made up the Bible, with it's miracles and commandments, love and atonement?
A large number of adherents to a variety of Jewish and early Christian religious sects. Several books are interesting works of literature, and rather well written for religious tracts.
Who was so clever as to understand the human condition and make up a solution that is beyond human understanding?
I'm sorry? The Bible, and religion in general, is an attempt to find simple solutions to complexities beyond human understanding. It is far simpler than the realities of a naturalistic universe
Ok.
Just a couple of points before I leave you both to your misery.
Our rule of law and the ethics on which we base our system of government and jursiprudence have a direct link to the Bible, which was understood by our Founding Fathers.
I don't understand that question. Why would anybody create a rule impossible to follow? Oh yes, to make perfectly ordinary people feel guilty unless they repent their "sins" [as defined by the local church] and tithe it.
Once again, human beings did not create the Laws of God in the Scripture......God did. When human beings create their own gods (e.g. the Romans and Greeks), they have human faults, and reflect the human imagination. Jesus does not. He is beyond the human capacity to imagine.
The commandments are impossible to follow, but through the grace of God and the sacrifice of Jesus Christ for our redemption, we are forgiven of our sins, and given the Holy Spirit to help us in our struggles to attain a more Holy life. Local churches are only extensions of the Church universal, and they are made up of human beings who sometimes create rules and regulations that are not of God.
It is clearly beyond human understanding to grasp the grace and love of God through Jesus Christ, but spiritual understanding is offered to us.
You, andy, have been invited to be the recipient of the grace, love and forgiveness of a Holy and Almighty God. You have the choice as to whether or not you reject that invitation. But if you reject God because of the bitterness you have due to some harm that a church, or an individual human has done to you in the past, you are making a mistake that might cost you for an eternity.
I would urge you to open God's Word and open your eyes and heart to see what is really there. I'm not going to convince you of anything with reason, logic or any argument I come up with. The only way you're going to find the truth is to be willing to hear the word of God as HE speaks to you.
The choice as to whether or not to do that is yours.
What prophesies have they gotten right?
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