Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Media Police Fudge Gun Facts in Sniper Shootings
CNS NEWS ^ | 10-7-02 | Jeff Johnson

Posted on 10/07/2002 3:21:47 AM PDT by gunnedah

Media and Authorities Fudge Gun Facts in Shootings By Jeff Johnson CNSNews.com Congressional Bureau Chief October 07, 2002

Capitol Hill (CNSNews.com) - Over the weekend, police linked another shooting to the gunman who killed six people last week in the Washington, D.C., area.

Police say a woman shot and seriously wounded on Friday in Fredericksburg, Va., was struck by a bullet from the same gun used to kill an elderly man Thursday night in Washington, D.C.; and five people killed on Wednesday and Thursday in the Washington suburb of Montgomery County, Md. (Fredericksburg is about 70 miles away from the general area of the other shootings.)

As police continue their search for one or two suspects in the shootings of those seven people -- six of whom died -- local, state, and federal authorities have been releasing information to the media to encourage public assistance with finding the shooters.

But firearms experts said Friday that at least some of that information has been conveyed in a less than accurate manner.

During an early morning press conference on Friday, Montgomery County, Md., Police Chief Charles Moose described the type of weapon investigators believe was used to commit the murders.

"We're willing, at this point, and able to say that from a 90-percent accuracy, we're dealing with a high-speed-velocity round from an assault or a hunting-type weapon," he said. "We're dealing with someone shooting from a distance, someone using a high-velocity round, 90 percent sure that it is a .223 round from a rifle, a hunting rifle, an assault rifle."

Authorities have confirmed that only one shot was fired, striking and killing six of the victims. That fact, and the use of the term "assault rifle," caught the attention of James Chambers, executive director of the Sporting Arms and Ammunition Manufacturers' Institute (SAAMI).

"An assault weapon is a machine gun -- that [means] fully-automatic, and that is a military firearm," he said, explaining that assault rifles, by definition, fire multiple bullets with each pull of the trigger.

Following Moose's comments, CNN Anchor Carol Costello on Friday summarized what officials had reported.

"Five people, all apparently unrelated, random victims, were shot dead by the same gun, according to the chief," she said. "It was a high-powered assault hunting-type weapon with a .223 round."

Chambers said the weapon Costello described doesn't exist.

"That is not an accurate statement. The .223 is a small game cartridge used for small game and varmint hunting. It is about half as powerful as the .30-06 or .308 caliber, which are the big game rifles for deer, elk, antelope, etcetera," he explained. "The .223 is not classified as a high-powered cartridge."

Later Friday morning, Moose called another press conference, intended to eliminate some of the confusion caused by the reporting of his statements.

"When we passed out some information, when we talked about rounds, when we talked about weapons, maybe we created some confusion and so, at the advice of ATF (the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, and Firearms) we want to take a few moments to, maybe, clarify some of that information," he explained.

The chief introduced Joseph Riehl, assistant special agent in charge of the Baltimore ATF office, who, along with a team of ATF firearms examiners, he described as "experts in this area."

Riehl displayed four rifles and four cartridges similar to the type believe to have been used by the murderer. He was careful to categorize the weapons and ammunition as "samples."

"We have laid out four samples of ammunition that are possibly used in these shootings. In addition, there are four firearms that are consistent, that are able, again, just samples, that are able to accept these particular rounds of ammunition," he explained. "This is not all of the firearms; there's a list of forearms that would accept these rounds of ammunition. It is too great a list to lay everything out."

At the urging of a reporter, Riehl picked up a Colt AR-15, which he properly identified as a semi-automatic rifle, and held it as he answered questions. He then lifted a bolt-action .223 caliber rifle and compared it to the AR-15.

"This is actually just a bolt-action rifle. This particular weapon could be used for target shooting, possibly hunting and it would not be considered the same as you would some of the other assault weapons," he said, gesturing to the semi-automatic AR-15.

Again, Chambers said the terminology used is simply wrong.

"They're classifying the civilian version of the military M-16, which is the AR-15, as an assault weapon, which is bogus," he said. "The AR-15 is not an assault weapon; it's a semi-automatic or auto-loading firearm ... one bullet per trigger pull."

The press conference apparently did not clear up the misconceptions. Friday afternoon, MSNBC reporter Jennifer Johnson described the weapon with similarly inaccurate terminology.

"The shooter used a high-powered assault weapon or some kind of high powered hunting rifle in all of the cases," she said.

Chambers noted the insistence of the establishment media personalities that the firearm used in the murders was an "assault weapon."

'Media definition' "The 'assault' term is a media definition for any firearm with certain appendages on it. Our definition, and the military definition of an 'assault weapon' is a fully automatic weapon," he explained.

The .223 cartridge, he continued, is accurately referred to as a "high-velocity" round, because the bullet travels at between 3000 and 3200 feet per second, depending on the weapon from which it is fired and the amount and type of powder loaded into the shell casing.

The bullet is deadly, he added, not because it is fired from a so-called "assault weapon," but because of its accuracy and the characteristics of the wound it creates.

"It is a very accurate round when used by someone with a great deal of experience. You can make very accurate shots from fairly long ranges, out to 500 yards," he said. "That particular bullet when it hits has a tendency as it enters to do some tumbling or rolling, which creates a great deal of mass, energy, and force."

Gun industry representatives, who spoke with CNSNews.com on condition of anonymity, said they believe the law enforcement officials who used the incorrect terminology probably did so under the stress of the investigation and the media scrutiny, not in an attempt to intentionally mislead the public.

They were not, however, so forgiving of the establishment media. One such representative said the misuse of the terms "assault weapon" and "high-powered" was "part of an intentional effort to scare people, to make the public afraid of guns."

Inaccurate reporting on firearms issues by the so-called "mainstream" media is something Chambers said he simply expects.

"How the media is reporting this does not surprise me in the least," he said. "I have seen this over, and over and over again, and I don't expect any changes in the near future."

E-mail a news tip to Jeff Johnson.

Send a Letter to the Editor about this article.

More Nation News

Media and Authorities Fudge Gun Facts in Shootings

Teachers Union Being Prosecuted for Illegally Spending Dues

Supreme Court To Review Sex-Offender Registries, 'Three Strikes' Laws

Supreme Court Session Could Hold Broad First Amendment Implications

Groups Protest Faith-Based Funds Recipient

Group Says Union to Blame for Lockout at West Coast Ports

Feds Arrest Six People Allegedly Linked to al Qaeda

Reid Pleads Guilty; Lindh Sentenced to 20 years

US Group Decries 'Censorship At the Canadian Border'

Random Murders May Play Role in Maryland Politics

Candidate Called A 'Tool of Trial Lawyers'

Study Claims Teamsters Union Nearly Free Of Organized Crime

Klamath River Salmon Dying -- Fed Biologists Puzzled

Archive

Top Headlines Media, Police Fudge Gun Facts in Sniper Shootings

Supreme Court Session Could Hold Broad First Amendment Implications

Supreme Court To Review Sex-Offender Registries

Bush To Speak on Iraq; Poll Indicates Public Has Doubts

Groups Protest Faith-Based Funds Recipient

Teachers Union Prosecuted for Illegally Spending Dues

Hamas Vows Revenge Following Israeli Attack on Palestinians

All original CNSNews.com material, copyright 1998-2002 Cybercast News Service.

Home | News This Hour | Politics | Culture | Business | International Nation | Pentagon | Extra | Commentary | Bozell's Column Cartoons | Fact-O-Rama | Privacy Policy

CNSNews.com is optimized for use with the latest version of either Microsoft Internet Explorer or Netscape Navigator. The latest versions are available from the respective companies web sites.


TOPICS: Extended News; Government; US: District of Columbia; US: Maryland; US: Virginia
KEYWORDS: banglist
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-2021-4041-45 next last
Media and Authorities Fudge Gun Facts in Shootings By Jeff Johnson CNSNews.com Congressional Bureau Chief October 07, 2002

Capitol Hill (CNSNews.com) - Over the weekend, police linked another shooting to the gunman who killed six people last week in the Washington, D.C., area.

Police say a woman shot and seriously wounded on Friday in Fredericksburg, Va., was struck by a bullet from the same gun used to kill an elderly man Thursday night in Washington, D.C.; and five people killed on Wednesday and Thursday in the Washington suburb of Montgomery County, Md. (Fredericksburg is about 70 miles away from the general area of the other shootings.)

As police continue their search for one or two suspects in the shootings of those seven people -- six of whom died -- local, state, and federal authorities have been releasing information to the media to encourage public assistance with finding the shooters.

But firearms experts said Friday that at least some of that information has been conveyed in a less than accurate manner.

During an early morning press conference on Friday, Montgomery County, Md., Police Chief Charles Moose described the type of weapon investigators believe was used to commit the murders.

"We're willing, at this point, and able to say that from a 90-percent accuracy, we're dealing with a high-speed-velocity round from an assault or a hunting-type weapon," he said. "We're dealing with someone shooting from a distance, someone using a high-velocity round, 90 percent sure that it is a .223 round from a rifle, a hunting rifle, an assault rifle."

Authorities have confirmed that only one shot was fired, striking and killing six of the victims. That fact, and the use of the term "assault rifle," caught the attention of James Chambers, executive director of the Sporting Arms and Ammunition Manufacturers' Institute (SAAMI).

"An assault weapon is a machine gun -- that [means] fully-automatic, and that is a military firearm," he said, explaining that assault rifles, by definition, fire multiple bullets with each pull of the trigger.

Following Moose's comments, CNN Anchor Carol Costello on Friday summarized what officials had reported.

"Five people, all apparently unrelated, random victims, were shot dead by the same gun, according to the chief," she said. "It was a high-powered assault hunting-type weapon with a .223 round."

Chambers said the weapon Costello described doesn't exist.

"That is not an accurate statement. The .223 is a small game cartridge used for small game and varmint hunting. It is about half as powerful as the .30-06 or .308 caliber, which are the big game rifles for deer, elk, antelope, etcetera," he explained. "The .223 is not classified as a high-powered cartridge."

Later Friday morning, Moose called another press conference, intended to eliminate some of the confusion caused by the reporting of his statements.

"When we passed out some information, when we talked about rounds, when we talked about weapons, maybe we created some confusion and so, at the advice of ATF (the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, and Firearms) we want to take a few moments to, maybe, clarify some of that information," he explained.

The chief introduced Joseph Riehl, assistant special agent in charge of the Baltimore ATF office, who, along with a team of ATF firearms examiners, he described as "experts in this area."

Riehl displayed four rifles and four cartridges similar to the type believe to have been used by the murderer. He was careful to categorize the weapons and ammunition as "samples."

"We have laid out four samples of ammunition that are possibly used in these shootings. In addition, there are four firearms that are consistent, that are able, again, just samples, that are able to accept these particular rounds of ammunition," he explained. "This is not all of the firearms; there's a list of forearms that would accept these rounds of ammunition. It is too great a list to lay everything out."

At the urging of a reporter, Riehl picked up a Colt AR-15, which he properly identified as a semi-automatic rifle, and held it as he answered questions. He then lifted a bolt-action .223 caliber rifle and compared it to the AR-15.

"This is actually just a bolt-action rifle. This particular weapon could be used for target shooting, possibly hunting and it would not be considered the same as you would some of the other assault weapons," he said, gesturing to the semi-automatic AR-15.

Again, Chambers said the terminology used is simply wrong.

"They're classifying the civilian version of the military M-16, which is the AR-15, as an assault weapon, which is bogus," he said. "The AR-15 is not an assault weapon; it's a semi-automatic or auto-loading firearm ... one bullet per trigger pull."

The press conference apparently did not clear up the misconceptions. Friday afternoon, MSNBC reporter Jennifer Johnson described the weapon with similarly inaccurate terminology.

"The shooter used a high-powered assault weapon or some kind of high powered hunting rifle in all of the cases," she said.

Chambers noted the insistence of the establishment media personalities that the firearm used in the murders was an "assault weapon."

'Media definition' "The 'assault' term is a media definition for any firearm with certain appendages on it. Our definition, and the military definition of an 'assault weapon' is a fully automatic weapon," he explained.

The .223 cartridge, he continued, is accurately referred to as a "high-velocity" round, because the bullet travels at between 3000 and 3200 feet per second, depending on the weapon from which it is fired and the amount and type of powder loaded into the shell casing.

The bullet is deadly, he added, not because it is fired from a so-called "assault weapon," but because of its accuracy and the characteristics of the wound it creates.

"It is a very accurate round when used by someone with a great deal of experience. You can make very accurate shots from fairly long ranges, out to 500 yards," he said. "That particular bullet when it hits has a tendency as it enters to do some tumbling or rolling, which creates a great deal of mass, energy, and force."

Gun industry representatives, who spoke with CNSNews.com on condition of anonymity, said they believe the law enforcement officials who used the incorrect terminology probably did so under the stress of the investigation and the media scrutiny, not in an attempt to intentionally mislead the public.

They were not, however, so forgiving of the establishment media. One such representative said the misuse of the terms "assault weapon" and "high-powered" was "part of an intentional effort to scare people, to make the public afraid of guns."

Inaccurate reporting on firearms issues by the so-called "mainstream" media is something Chambers said he simply expects.

"How the media is reporting this does not surprise me in the least," he said. "I have seen this over, and over and over again, and I don't expect any changes in the near future."

E-mail a news tip to Jeff Johnson.

Send a Letter to the Editor about this article.

More Nation News

Media and Authorities Fudge Gun Facts in Shootings

Teachers Union Being Prosecuted for Illegally Spending Dues

Supreme Court To Review Sex-Offender Registries, 'Three Strikes' Laws

Supreme Court Session Could Hold Broad First Amendment Implications

Groups Protest Faith-Based Funds Recipient

Group Says Union to Blame for Lockout at West Coast Ports

Feds Arrest Six People Allegedly Linked to al Qaeda

Reid Pleads Guilty; Lindh Sentenced to 20 years

US Group Decries 'Censorship At the Canadian Border'

Random Murders May Play Role in Maryland Politics

Candidate Called A 'Tool of Trial Lawyers'

Study Claims Teamsters Union Nearly Free Of Organized Crime

Klamath River Salmon Dying -- Fed Biologists Puzzled

Archive

Top Headlines Media, Police Fudge Gun Facts in Sniper Shootings

Supreme Court Session Could Hold Broad First Amendment Implications

Supreme Court To Review Sex-Offender Registries

Bush To Speak on Iraq; Poll Indicates Public Has Doubts

Groups Protest Faith-Based Funds Recipient

Teachers Union Prosecuted for Illegally Spending Dues

Hamas Vows Revenge Following Israeli Attack on Palestinians

All original CNSNews.com material, copyright 1998-2002 Cybercast News Service.

Home | News This Hour | Politics | Culture | Business | International Nation | Pentagon | Extra | Commentary | Bozell's Column Cartoons | Fact-O-Rama | Privacy Policy

CNSNews.com is optimized for use with the latest version of either Microsoft Internet Explorer or Netscape Navigator. The latest versions are available from the respective companies web sites.

1 posted on 10/07/2002 3:21:47 AM PDT by gunnedah
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: gunnedah
Sorry for double posting. The Liberal News Media and some of the Nations Police Departments are putting out eroneous information about weapons. To think a Chief of Police doesnt know what an assault weapon is or maybe he is just being PC!
2 posted on 10/07/2002 3:26:14 AM PDT by gunnedah
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: dansangel
)))))))PING((((((((
3 posted on 10/07/2002 3:31:27 AM PDT by .45MAN
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: gunnedah
Not only are they calling a .22 round “high powered”, numerous reporters and talking heads have stated that the shooter must be a well trained marksman using a scope.
Before I retired from the Army, most of us thought a range of 150 yards was nearly point blank.
4 posted on 10/07/2002 3:33:27 AM PDT by R. Scott
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: gunnedah
I agree that an "Assault Rifle" is a military machine gun, but the feds have defined it as something else in federal law. So legally they were right, but that doesn't make them any smarter.

Link to U.S. Code here Title 18 Section 921

(30)

The term ''semiautomatic assault weapon'' means -

(A)

any of the firearms, or copies or duplicates of the firearms in any caliber, known as -

(i)

Norinco, Mitchell, and Poly Technologies Avtomat Kalashnikovs (all models);

(ii)

Action Arms Israeli Military Industries UZI and Galil;

(iii)

Beretta Ar70 (SC-70);

(iv)

Colt AR-15;

(v)

Fabrique National FN/FAL, FN/LAR, and FNC;

(vi)

SWD M-10, M-11, M-11/9, and M-12;

(vii)

Steyr AUG;

(viii)

INTRATEC TEC-9, TEC-DC9 and TEC-22; and

(ix)

revolving cylinder shotguns, such as (or similar to) the Street Sweeper and Striker 12;

(B)

a semiautomatic rifle that has an ability to accept a detachable magazine and has at least 2 of -

(i)

a folding or telescoping stock;

(ii)

a pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon;

(iii)

a bayonet mount;

(iv)

a flash suppressor or threaded barrel designed to accommodate a flash suppressor; and

(v)

a grenade launcher;

(C)

a semiautomatic pistol that has an ability to accept a detachable magazine and has at least 2 of -

(i)

an ammunition magazine that attaches to the pistol outside of the pistol grip;

(ii)

a threaded barrel capable of accepting a barrel extender, flash suppressor, forward handgrip, or silencer;

(iii)

a shroud that is attached to, or partially or completely encircles, the barrel and that permits the shooter to hold the firearm with the nontrigger hand without being burned;

(iv)

a manufactured weight of 50 ounces or more when the pistol is unloaded; and

(v)

a semiautomatic version of an automatic firearm; and

(D)

a semiautomatic shotgun that has at least 2 of -

(i)

a folding or telescoping stock;

(ii)

a pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon;

(iii)

a fixed magazine capacity in excess of 5 rounds; and

(iv)

an ability to accept a detachable magazine.


5 posted on 10/07/2002 3:47:01 AM PDT by HogFixer
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: R. Scott
Right. Yesterday on Fox News Tony Snow described this as a high-powered rifle and that .223 is used only by a few rifles. No one on the news with him corrected this inaccuracy.
6 posted on 10/07/2002 3:48:01 AM PDT by Alas Babylon!
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4 | View Replies]

To: gunnedah; TigersEye
My prayer from the first reports of this evil shooting spree has been that an armed citizen with a conscience and an opportunity will stop this murderer dead in his tracks.

Of course, if that does happen, the Liberal Media may never tell us.

Thank God for Free Republic!

7 posted on 10/07/2002 3:49:19 AM PDT by .30Carbine
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: R. Scott
To use the word "fudge" in this story is almost as misleading as the officals use of the words "high velocity" "devasting" etc...

Chief Moose wasnt the only one taking advantage of the crimes to promote a climate of anti gun hysteria..

The head fed and company had an M16 A1 rifle held over head while promoting the idea that "they knew" which weapon was used in these murders...and the FOX (fairly unbalanced) NEWS team zeroed right in on that baby..and every military type rifle on the table the feds had prepared for the media feeding frenzy..

The feds pushed the assault rifle theory not just Chief Moose..and the FOX NEWS team fed this "fudge" to the people all day long..

Funny how silent the media now is on these murders..out of sight out of mind...soon if no others are committed we will be left with only a distant memory of people killed by thugs
Mothers shot children burned..

In the military and police "snipers" save lives "enemy snipers" take lives in war..
The people who committed these crimes are "murderers" "killers" ..."Terrorists"
And clowns are waving assault rifles "fudging" data for a hungry FOX pursuing an agenda..imo
The remmnants of nearly a decadent decade clintons and renos and the like
8 posted on 10/07/2002 3:54:18 AM PDT by joesnuffy
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4 | View Replies]

To: .30Carbine
From the article: "there's a list of forearms that would accept these rounds of ammunition."

Spellcheck does'nt always help!

9 posted on 10/07/2002 3:54:37 AM PDT by Rebelbase
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: gunnedah; *bang_list
BTTT
10 posted on 10/07/2002 3:57:05 AM PDT by Fiddlstix
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: gunnedah
The only thing that surprises me about the media today is when they get something right.

I was a little surprised that James Chambers said this:

That particular bullet when it hits has a tendency as it enters to do some tumbling or rolling, which creates a great deal of mass, energy, and force.

This is some very interesting physics. Some of these firearms experts are doing our cause more harm than good.

Hank

11 posted on 10/07/2002 4:24:23 AM PDT by Hank Kerchief
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: gunnedah
Just more misinformation put for ward by the anti gun crowd and people who don;t know a thing about weapons but want most people to think that owning and useing firearms in a bad thing.
12 posted on 10/07/2002 4:27:23 AM PDT by riverrunner
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: HogFixer
I agree that an "Assault Rifle" is a military machine gun, but the feds have defined it as something else in federal law

Actually, "assault rifle" means exactly what it always has. The neologism that the FedGov manufactured out of whole cloth was "assault weapon".

13 posted on 10/07/2002 4:44:45 AM PDT by RogueIsland
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 5 | View Replies]

To: riverrunner
These shootings are extremely deceptive. It seems to be timed and then made to look like the shooter is heading south when they are actually moving in the opposite direction. There are too many coincidences between these shootings; the Chief, Moose, who seemed genuinely angry that someone had been shot in DC bringing in the feds and costing him control of the situation, and his having worked for the same mayor of Portland that Jeffery Battles worked for. He has been issuing confusing press statements almost every hour, always with some kind of new twist that later has to be cleared up. This is some kind of setup and it won't be a 223 round that is used the next time. This was target practice and there IS a target.
14 posted on 10/07/2002 4:45:15 AM PDT by Nix 2
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 12 | View Replies]

To: gunnedah
"That particular bullet when it hits has a tendency as it enters to do some tumbling or rolling, which creates a great deal of mass, energy, and force."

Wow, that's some cartridge if it creates mass and energy. Do the physicists at CERN know about this?

15 posted on 10/07/2002 4:47:17 AM PDT by RogueIsland
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: gunnedah
It is interesting that no one has brought up the fact that there are pistols like the TC Contender that fire this round.
16 posted on 10/07/2002 4:47:27 AM PDT by Taxbilly
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: gunnedah
Mr Chambers (and what an interesting name for a firearms expert!) states "That particular bullet when it hits has a tendency as it enters to do some tumbling or rolling, which creates a great deal of mass, energy, and force."

Media eites should seek out firearms experts for help with this area in which they are clearly clueless, and Mr. Chambers should see out a physics expert for help in his area of un-expertise.
17 posted on 10/07/2002 4:58:49 AM PDT by fnord
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: gunnedah
Why does it have to be an "assault" rifle? I have a Magnum Research Lone Eagle pistol with barrels for 223, 22-250, 220 swift, and 22PPC, along with 15 other larger rifle calibers. I hunt out to 250 yards with it.
18 posted on 10/07/2002 4:59:42 AM PDT by SirFishalot
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: SirFishalot
I hope you don't fish with them. LOL
I guess you could hunt Moose with them. I keep wondering when someone is going to mention cheese.
I'm expecting the next shot will be a 50 cal. No cheesy bullets no more.
The oldtimer who makes up my rounds has been amazed at the distractive attention being paid to the 223 rounds and hardly any to the shooter/s. They couldn't have been at some of the distances mentioned in passing by these guys. So why are they building it up as if these guys are wondershots?
19 posted on 10/07/2002 5:12:40 AM PDT by Nix 2
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 18 | View Replies]

To: Hank Kerchief
Nothing in science has ever been proven true.

"Proven," to whom?

So you do not believe that water consists of molecules comprised of one part oxygen and two parts hydrogen.

Hank

20 posted on 10/07/2002 5:23:22 AM PDT by Hank Kerchief
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 11 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-2021-4041-45 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson