What would Jesus do?__Joseph Farah(God is not a pacifist)

worldnetdaily.com ^ | 9-13-02 | Joseph Farah

[ovrtaxt]

That and Romans 13:3-- "For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is a minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil."

Let the terrorists be afraid of our righteous enforcement of a civilized law.

[#3Fan]

Farah got one right for once. LOL

The "turn the other cheek" verse came in the context of the ministry. If you offend while ministering, then turn the other cheek. If I guy walks up and punches you on the street for no reason, then put the hurt on him if you're able.

[Icthus]

[M. T. Cicero II]

I like the article and Comment #1. It seems to me that the liberation of the people of Iraq is reason enuf to prosecute the war. Shame on us for leaving this oppresive government in power. The country has some great deeds to its credit. Let's add another.

[MissAmericanPie]

I have heard it argued that turning the other cheek was a customary act of defiance at that time and in that culture. I am not familiar with the customs of the times that Jesus lived in, so I can't confirm or deny it.

[ovrtaxt]

Yes, the people of Iraq need to be free. And the overarching concern of God, I think, is the freedom to proclaim Jesus Christ as Lord in that society. Islam has held a stranglehold over that entire region for too many centuries.

Thank God we have a leader who is interested in spreading freedom instead of an intern's legs.

[lexington minuteman 1775]

My belief is that the Bible is not clear on war vs. pacifism.You can make a textual argument for Biblical pacifism, for the Just War Theory, and for a Crusade or Holy War as we see at times in the Old Testament.

I thought this was an intresting article.And altho I do believe that historic Biblical pacifism is relevant and Scriptural, I don't see how it would work in a world filled with men like Sadaam or religious fanatics like Al Queda who are bent on destroying us and our culture.

[ovrtaxt]

I think He was talking about non-resistance in the face of aggression, but that's only when you are being attacked when proclaiming the Gospel. In that case, Jesus says they are rejecting Him, not you, so the fight is His.

That's a true martyr, not some suicidal murderer detonating a bomb in a crowd of innocents.

[Spacetrucker]

Hehehehe... Spread the Good Word instead of fornication? I'll give an "AMEN!!!" to that!

[Hackle]

Let the terrorists be afraid of our righteous enforcement of a civilized law.

And what about us? A nation that permits the killing of 4,000 unborn children every day? We should fear God's righteous enforcement of His just law, repent, and receive Christ's forgiveness.

[anguish]

Deuteronomy 13:12-16

If you hear it said about one of the towns the Lord your God is giving you to live in that wicked men have arisen among you and have led the people of their town astray, saying, "Let us go and worship other gods" (gods you have not known), then you must inquire, probe and investigate it thoroughly. And if it is true and it has been proved that this detestable thing has been done among you, you must certainly put to the sword all who live in that town. Destroy it completely, both its people and its livestock. Gather all the plunder of the town into the middle of the public square and completely burn the town and all its plunder as a whole burnt offering to the Lord your God. It is to remain a ruin forever, never to be rebuilt.

Ops.. Won't be too many cities left to live in.

[smith288]

I believe "offer the other (cheek)", i think, means that if you get slapped, front the person. Show him it didnt bother you. Now if the person cut your arm off, Jesus doesnt recommend offering the other as the level of violence doesnt equal a slap in the face. Jesus would recommend a can a whup a_ _ in self defense.

[ovrtaxt]

I do believe that there is a morality of violence. The Cops operate under that premise all the time. The innocent must be protected, and certainly women and kids must be protected. Romans 13:1 claims that God ordains just governments in the earth. Unjust governments are usually the result of man trying to take the place of God in terms of controlling the population and denying the freedom to choose who one will worship.

John the apostle said the spirit of antichrist has enterd the world, and that already many antichrists have manifested. (antichrist- one who puts himself in the place of Christ.) Thus the worship cult of many leaders.

[ovrtaxt]

"And what about us? A nation that permits the killing of 4,000 unborn children every day? We should fear God's righteous enforcement of His just law, repent, and receive Christ's forgiveness."

I agree, and fortunately God understands how our republic is set up. He knows that there are many here who work and pray and wait for it to stop. His judgment (and salvation)does fall on individuals who resist Him here, but He's not dumb. He knows we are His nation in many more ways.

[goldstategop]

No. Jesus was articulating an ideal not applicable to the real world. No Christian country has ever lived up to it for its impossible. If Christians had lived by that precept in the Middle Ages, Islam would be ruling the world today. When it comes to the wicked, you must resist or you wind up being dead. If we all lived in the world Jesus envisioned, turning the cheek would be lovely, but it doesn't exist and never did. About the only place you can find true peace is in Heaven and that's a different place from here.

[agrace]

I love that verse, especially in light of what's happened this past year. God gives us leaders defend our country and to exact judgement. We are to support them. It's one of the most powerful verses against a policy of non-government support based on pacifism, imo.

It also makes me appreciate even more the one we have in charge now. God bless President Bush, he's got a big job, to put it mildly.

[ovrtaxt]

I half agree. The pacifism part is in play ONLY when you are a minister of the Gospel. When you are a minister of justice and a civil, righteous law, violence is a necessary tool for stopping evil. When I need a cop, I want him to show up with a loaded firearm. And when MY house is invaded, I will use mine.

But if I preach the gospel, and Im attacked for the message's sake, I should not resist.

The naive pacifists that inaccurately quote the Bible as a pacifist document are ignorant of it.

[txzman]

Most Christians do not realize the cultural implication behind Jesus' Parable - which is significant.

In Roman society, hitting the cheek was done as a sign of master to slave with the "back of the hand" - an indication that power was inherent and did not need to be expressed physically.

However, Jesus said to 'turn the other cheek'. This meant that the same person would now have to strike you with the 'other' side of the hand - ie the open hand. In Roman society, this kind of striking was done among peers, or equals - ie citizen to citizen.

What Christ was saying was altogether different than the 'weakness' we suppose today - that you say to another:

"OK - you hit me. I am going to show you God's mercy and love - I am not going to hit you; in fact you can hit me again. Just realize that THIS time, I am choosing to let you hit me as an equal!

Thus Jesus was telling his audience how to demonstrate God's love but to retain - nay even take back - your Christian dignity and equality in the sight of God. Very powerful stuff!

[DugwayDuke]

J. Vernon McGee gives another interpretation in his commentaries. Essentially, he says that the Sermon On The Mount is a description of how Christians will live after the Kingdom of God is established on earth. IOW, how we would live in a perfect world and not a prescription for how we should live in this world.

[ovrtaxt]

That's pretty cool. A christian is a slave to no man. In fact, Paul said you are either a slave to Christ or a slave to sin. Yes, another can physically enslave you by force, but inwardly you are more free than your master.

I guess that's why totalitarian governments fear Christianity so much. How can you control people with that kind of reality living within them?