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To: branicap
Before Milosevic, were there often acts of brutality by (non-Albanian) Muslim police towards Serbs? Did it happen in the ‘80’s, ‘70’s, 60’s, etc.?

If this was known by you, and given that you were requested to coach - “As a distinguished judoist many times I was coaching young policemen on the request of their superiors.” - “request” doesn’t imply obligation, as they were rather asking a favor because of your expertise, (and not because you were working for the government), could you have refused to coach all Muslims? What would have happened if you said, “I refuse to coach Muslims as they are backstabbers and there’s significant chance they will use their knowledge to hurt Serbs?” Would they then have sent you just non-Muslims to train, or would they have foregone sending you any young policemen? It certainly doesn’t seem like you needed their business anyway: firstly you were a doctor/surgeon, and therefore had another job; secondly you said you were quite successful and well known, so you were probably getting enough students coming on their own, and not through the police.

And, unless Naser Oric cussed Serbs and denied the WWII massacre on the last day of the approximately 6 months of training in your class, could you not have kicked him out? Seriously, his statement and attitude were ominous, so could you not have told the police that you had a serious personal grievance with Naser, refunded them for future classes they may have paid up, and booted him out of your classes if he dared to show up again?

We were taken to the Padinska Skela Prison,thrown in the cell and half an our later "barbarians"arived.Prison guards reinforced by a Muslims from Sandzak!They would come into the cell with 10-15 of us and started kicking the s*** aout of us.Men,women indiscriminately!"Want to demonstrate you f*****g Chetnics,F**k your Chetnic`s mothers!People colapsing,being bitten sensless,all night.

You’re right, they did go on to do the same things to imprisoned Bosnian Serbs. Have you heard of a man named Slavko Jovicic Slavuj, and a book he wrote about his life in a concentration camp called "Silos" ([Serb] Oslobodjenje, 1997)?

His experience with Sandzak Muslims echoes yours, but on an even crueler level.

Song for Carla Del Ponte

The conditions cannot be described with words. Between 40 and 60 camp inmates were kept in cells measuring 5 by 5 meters [15 by 15 feet]. We were beaten daily. No words need be wasted on describing verbal abuse. The beatings were conducted by the local guards and the Bosniaks from Sandzak who were only passing through Tarcin. Anyone who wanted to torture and beat prisoners found open doors in "Silos". According to what I know, 25 inmates died in the camp. I saw those deaths with my own eyes, but it is possible that there were more of them.

15 posted on 09/05/2002 11:59:13 AM PDT by joan
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To: joan
good info
17 posted on 09/05/2002 1:28:22 PM PDT by vooch
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To: joan; smokegenerator; DTA; FireWall; vooch; kosta50; pythagorean; crazykatz; Kate22; All
#15

Joan,for you and all non-Yugoslavs a short lecture:

Police in all Yugoslavias,so far,had always been very brutal!Use of (un)"reasonable force" was a common norm!Yugo-policemen were very batton-happy!That was a fact of life!If you were arrested(for any reason)the chances that you will be beaten a little bit just for the sake of it,and to fear them in future vere big!Take my word for it!I have seen it so many times!It is the way they vere trained:"Remember,it is us against them!They tell jokes about us,they(population) think that were stupid!We have to stick together and show them who`s the boss!" was an informal lecture given to the young cadets in Police School in Sremska Kamenica inthe school caffeteria!And,they behaved accordingly.

I wasn`t working for the government,my relation with the police was sport related,and their request to train some of their guys was purely friendly request;if yo see that some civilian is better coach than your own than you will try to engage him to improve level of training of both your own(police) judo,karate teams and regular self defence training for the regular policemen.After some time,it went beyond that,into more serious work,full body guard training,personal protection, fire arms...

Police job was not very popular among urban people but was atractive for the people from the provinces,because it was a goverment job,steady income and opportunity to move into a town,the bigger the better!Naser Orich is a typical example:a peasant,not even from Srebrenica town but a smal village,as a policeman he finished his carrier in....Belgrade!I believe that he saw a traffic lighte for the first time in his life when he arrived there!As I said,ideal boy for the police!He was only one among the thousands.Don`t get me wrong,there`s nothing wrong with that!Ask yourself;who in US joins the Marines?New York intellectuals??Hardly!Californian surffers??Don`t think so!Mix a provincial background,sense of allienation in the big city,low oppinion of the "natives",indroctrination style;they don`t like you so show them who`s the boss and you get BRUTALITY as a final resault!Simple.

Joan,I and millions of other Belgraders or Serbians and Yugoslavs couldn`t care less who was Muslim,or Croat,or Serbian!And,I`m still the same!So,there was no way that I would refuse an invitation to coach a group of police,men in self defence on the ground of their nationality!Do you understand?If I had a time machine I would like to go 15 years back and kick the shit out of mujahedin Orich,with pleasure!But,maybe in some other life!To cut a long story short:if a p[olice is not under the control of democratic institutions;if an indenpendent body tor complains don`t egzist,you have brutality!Add a bit of national flavour and you have a grater brutality!

I`m affraid,Kosta,my friend,you re right!As usual.Good to hear from you again.

Naser Orich will never see the inside of the Hague cell!I predict for him a restaurant in some Turkish town or...six feet under,courtesy of CIA!

25 posted on 09/05/2002 9:41:33 PM PDT by branicap
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