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>>People should but if they don't want to and no one insures that they do, are you proposing we just forget about them and not discuss them because they are losers? What do we do with their kids?<<

I'm not trying to be a smart alec when I say this, but, They're not OUR kids. The question, "what do we do with their kids" assumes some implied responsibility on our part. There is none.

Yes, we can choose to help (or meddle, as some would see it), but it is not the direct responsibility of our government. Churches and volunteer groups could choose to help and often do. That's as far as it should go in a non-socialistic country.

Would it be fair to the kids? Well, what is fair? Is it fair that a kid is born in the projects and not a middle class neighborhood? Is it fair I was not born a Rockefeller?

It's just life, and we all learn to play the hand we're dealt as best we can. It is great that individuals choose to help those less fortunate than themselves, and I believe that used to be the backbone of our culture a long time ago.

But once you get government involved in helping the poor, you've gutted Gods whole purpose behind the "giving and receiving" equation. That is a prime reason we're in the trouble we're in now.

The core issue is this: Life is a mist. A mans life is a passing shadow. Eternity is what matters. It is better to learn hard lessons that shorten this brief life than to prolong this life as long as possible and ignore the deeper issues. The preservation of life and comfort and "quality upbringing is not the high principle many make it out to be.

If you believe there is no God or afterlife, then this is all there is and you want to do everything you can to improve it. But if one expands their thinking beyond this brief life, you understand why men march as a human wall into a wave of mine balls and canon shot. You understand why a man would say "give me liberty or give me death." And you understand why twelve men would follow the teachings of one man who allowed himself to be tortured and killed, utterly destroying His life here but sealing eternity for them and me. And all but one of them suffered similar fates because there fate and future was not dependent on this world and its comforts.

It is this belief system ALONE that keeps me from taking the law into my own hands against a family court system that riteously deserves any harm that comes to it. But I would violate everything I believe and stand for if I were to take any such action. It is an evil I have learned to put up with, much like the IRS.

Unless I am willing to take up arms against my own government, as our forefathers did, I will let it be. Besides, it is quite obvious that it is all going to implode soon enough, as all evil eventually does.

They're not OUR kids. The question, "what do we do with their kids" assumes some implied responsibility on our part. There is none.

The opposite of that then is to simply throw small children into the gutter. Is that the step you'd like to see?

No? Then they become "our" kids, because when both parents walk, we put them in orphanages, hoping to find someone to adopt, while the state...errr taxpayers...pay their way.

Would it be fair to the kids? Well, what is fair? Is it fair that a kid is born in the projects and not a middle class neighborhood? Is it fair I was not born a Rockefeller?

If you believe that, then you'll have a hard time explaining why a thief should go to jail. Is it "fair" that they stole from you? Life isn't fair. But it assumes some implied responsibility on our part to track them down and jail them.

But once you get government involved in helping the poor, you've gutted Gods whole purpose behind the "giving and receiving" equation.

This is no time to start in about God...unless you would like to explain where God's plan was to disobey the laws of the land.

The preservation of life and comfort and "quality upbringing is not the high principle many make it out to be.

"Preservation of life"? Do we also allow murderers free reign?

If you believe there is no God or afterlife, then this is all there is and you want to do everything you can to improve it.

And you believe God's master plan was for man to forsake his family? Should we still be stoning adulterers?

It is an evil I have learned to put up with, much like the IRS.

Taxes are necessary. While you may not agree with them, explain how a system would work without them. Explain how this lawless system you seem to be advocating would work. God never expected us to not pass laws, He even admonishes us to obey them. You either want none or want to pick and choose. If it's the latter, the easy solution is to provide just one solid reason for why we should have a law against the irresponsible behavior of thievery and not against the irresponsible behavior of abandoning your own children. One thing alone that makes them different. They both affect other ppl negatively. They are both choices that one person makes that will have an impact on others. They are both irresponsible choices.