Posted on 08/12/2002 12:50:43 PM PDT by Sub-Driver
FAA says it had 11 other suspect planes on Sept. 11
Monday August 12, 2002
By RICHARD PYLE Associated Press Writer
WESTBURY, N.Y. (AP) In the tense minutes after two hijacked jetliners smashed into New York's World Trade Center and another hit the Pentagon, air traffic controllers had as many as 11 other suspect aircraft on their screens, federal aviation officials said Monday.
The concern over possible additional hijackings did not end until 12:15 p.m. on Sept. 11 3{ hours after the first attack on the twin towers when the last of 4,546 commercial aircraft were safely on the ground nationwide.
``Somewhere in the first hour after the first plane hit, we were receiving reports of additional confirmed hijackings. The list at that point in time started to grow,'' said Frank Hatfield, Eastern Region division manager for FAA air traffic control operations.
``All reports were treated as unconfirmed hijackings until we eliminated that as a possibility. We were not satisfied that the last number was four until 12:15 p.m., and every airplane in the country was on the ground,'' he said.
``No one had ever envisioned a scenario where the United States would land every plane in the sky.''
Airports became jammed with the unexpected aircraft, yet there were no mishaps, he said.
Hatfield and other FAA officials briefed news media on Monday at the New York Terminal Approach Control Center, known as TRACON, on Long Island.
Mike McCormick, air traffic control manager at New York Center the main traffic control center for New York area airports made the unprecedented decision at 9:04 a.m. to declare ``ATC Zero,'' meaning that normal services were suspended and no aircraft could fly into, out of or through the region's airspace.
At that time there were still hundreds of aircraft in the skies around New York and the western Atlantic, for which the Long Island-based center had responsibility.
The decision came just after the second plane, United Airlines Flight 175, struck the south tower of the World Trade Center, confirming that the country was under terrorist attack.
Unlike the first hijacked plane, American Airlines Flight 11, the second Boeing 767's transponder was working and he knew where it was headed, McCormick said, even before the Newark Airport control tower picked it up visually as it flew south along the Hudson River, turned and headed back toward the twin towers.
``I wanted to make sure everyone understood that this (attack) was not a single aircraft, that this was not a single event. There was at least one other aircraft involved and there could be many more, and we needed to prepare for all eventualities,'' McCormick said.
The officials said many changes have been effected in emergency procedures since Sept. 11 but declined to go into detail for security reasons.
Hatfield said, however, that the time frame for the FAA to make contact with the military in an emergency ``has been shaved from minutes to seconds.''
On that day, the first two military interceptors, Air Force F-15 Eagles from Otis Air Force Base in Massachusetts, scrambled airborne at 8:52 a.m., six minutes after the first attack, but too late to do anything about the other jets heading for the Trade Center or Pentagon.
Those struck at 9:02 and 9:40 a.m., respectively. The fourth hijacked plane, United Airlines Flight 93, crashed near Somerset, Pa., at 10:07 a.m.
McCormick said that under the new procedures, ``We are in direct instantaneous communication with our military and those people responsible for defending our country.''
Hatfield said security now has a much higher priority than it did before Sept. 11.
``We have searched our souls and tried to figure out what we could have done differently on that day,'' he said. ``Probably the best thing we could have done was to improve our communications, and over the last year we have aggressively addressed that issue.''
You'd have to show probable cause.
And for that, you'd have to show some reason to believe that Sergei Denko (or Davidenko) was directly involved with the attack in some fashion--and I'm willing to bet that said reason is in fact nonexistent.
posted on 8/13/02 4:45 PM Central by Poohbah
re: probable cause -
take a look at ground zero.
The FEMA Report does not explain how the sprinkler system was disabled, based on their investigation they concluded it was disabled.
re: “you'd have to show some reason to believe that Sergei Denko (or Davidenko) was directly involved with the attack in some fashion.”
A photo ID pass for Sept. 5 found on one of the men charged with fraudulently obtaining a Tennessee driver's license from a Memphis woman gave him access to the six underground levels of the One World Center building.
Hammad told federal authorities that he was working on the sprinklers six days before the twin towers were brought down by terrorists, court testimony revealed this week.
3/28/02, reported in only two Memphis news articles I could find, he is released on bail with no objection from the DA. His father, Peter Hansen, reportedly an engineer for the City of New York who immigrated from Jordan 15 years ago, who now lives on Staten Island, brought a letter from Rocky's "boss", a Sergei Denko of Denko Mechanical Ltd. (not Magic Plumbing). In phone calls to the number listed, not published in the news articles, Mr. Sergei Denko verified that Rocky and his cousin (also arrested in the Memphis scam) were working in the WTC garage and lower level basement "for a couple of days" in early September
The Port Authority is on the record stating there was no work order issued for any work by Denko Mechanical.
Second, the access was to the lower levels of the WTC. This area includes several businesses and would not be under complete control of the Port Authority. Note that the sprinkler system for the upper floors cannot be disabled from the underground area.
How about spending your time chasing real Islamic militants (it's not like they're hiding; read Steve Emerson's book), instead of adding bad Grade-Z movie touches?
Any competent DA would laugh at your "probable cause." You could get an incompetent DA to go for it--but he will then either get laughed at by the judge when he asks for a search warrant, or the appellate court will laugh at him as they exclude all evidence obtained under a defective search warrant.
Get me something more solid than this.
Katerine Smith was not burned alive with gasoline in Odtllah's car one day before her court appearance in order to cover up a simple driver's license scam.
You add this to your summation and I firmly believe there is sufficient reason for a law enforcement represenative or an investigative reporter to investigate whether Denko Mechanical is a legitimate company and if they had a legitimate reason for having unlicensed plumbers work on the sprinkler system.
Someone needs to ask Mr.Hicks if the lease agreement for tenants in the World Trade Center required the Port Authority to repair and maintain the sprinkler system. If the lease agreement established that the Port Authority had the responsibility to maintain the sprinkler system, why would a tenant go out and pay money needlessly to hire Denko Mechanical's unlicensed plumbers to do a job better left to professional, licensed plumbers?
Reason One:
These five Islamic militants are involved in the murder of Katherine Smith,IMHO. She was burned alive with gasoline. They need to see justice.
Part II: No one was sure if hijackers were on board (A USA Today 9/11 must read Part II)
Korean Air jet may have narrowly missed disaster
Just doing some cross referencing here and indexing/networking ;-)
No sh!t? Wow, that's one to make you stop and think.
So how do they get notified now- or pre 9/11- how would they know when a plane was hijacked? I mean regarding this old system. (Obviously if the hijackers call and start making demands, they know right away) But in a situation like 9/11 where the hijackers aren't interested in letting the FAA know that they have commandeered the airliner, how long would it have taken the FAA to figure it out?
I agree with the other poster, if this stuff is that old- wow, that's quite a task they accomplished that day.
Fitz, I can appreciate your concern, and it would not surprise me if they would try anything. Remember this, however. The Soviets were quite afraid of millions of armed Americans, so they never really had a plan to invade. Also, think of the logistical nightmare it would be for large amounts of foreign troops, with tanks, artillery, combat aircraft, etc, to land here. Remember how long it took us to build up our forces in the Gulf in 91. It took about 7 months. Even with no president and no congress, the US Navy would find large transport ships, and sink them all. I am sure they intended to do more damage than they did, and will try again in the future. We need to do them in before they can do us in.
I, too, prefer shaving with Occam's brand products.
We used to have a Battalion Commander that was really fond of asking a troop "What's the first thing you know?"
The troop would usually stare at him dumbfounded. The Colonel would then go on to say "The first thing you know, ole Jedd's a millionaire--- in other words don't make it any more complicated than it needs to be".
I was never sure about the analogy, but the lesson stuck 10 times out of 10- keep it simple- that's the ticket.
Depends... What time did the FAA realize that Flights 77 and 93 were hijacked? I would say that would be a determining factor.
Around 1994-95 Newt Ginrich used to include the information about the air traffic control computers in his stock speach and would show a vacuum tube from one of them as a prop. The replacement vacuum tubes aren't even available from American manufactures; we actually have to import them from Russia. While the US was developing the capability to manufacture integrated circuits, the Soviet Union perfected "zero defect" vacuum tubes. From what I have been told, theses vacuum tubes are excellent for use in tube audio amplifiers. The other major problem is that the software used on these systems was written in an obscure and obsolete programming language that is no longer taught. Not only have most of the original programmers retired, but many of them have died.
in many cases, leases for commercial space will provide that the leasee provide for improvements, repairs, and maintenance inside their space, while the leasor will provide improvements, repairs, and maintenance for the exterior & common areas.
didn't denko mechanical state that they were operating in the parking garage? if so wouldn't that be the responsibility of the leasor?
They pleaded guilty on credit card fraud.IIRC, the amount of the fraud was in the range of $400,000.
You are correct and you highlight an excellent point.
Odtllah was later extradited back to Utah, but the mother of the child dropped the charge. However, DiScenza argued that the incident showed Odtllah was a flight risk on the conspiracy charge."
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This is the type of vermin that walked after four months in a Memphis jail. Katherine Smith was found burned alive with gasoline in Odtllah's car.If nothing else, the prosecutors should have insisted on the maximum sentence for Odtllah. For some reason, no one wanted a trial. The prosecutor had an open and shut case against Odtllah on videotape. Why accept a plea of four months before the medical examiner has made a determination of homicide or suicide in the Katherine Smith death.
I wonder where in Florida did Odtllah flea to? I think some of the hijackers spent some time in Florida.
In the Friday hearing, FBI agent J. Suzanne Nash testified that Odtllah had been extradited from Florida in 1997 after fleeing a sodomy charge in Utah. Nash said Odtllah had been charged with "committing an act" on the 12-year-old sister of Odtllah's then-girlfriend. Nash said that after being extradited the charges against Odtllah were dropped.
Federal authorities learned that Odtllah drove to Memphis from New York City on Sept. 11, Nash said.
That is FBI agent J. Suzanne Nash in the statement.
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