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To: FreedomFriend
Points to ponder:

• Amnesty will not stop illegal immigration.
• Yet, amnesties and illegal immigration with both continue into the foreseeable future.
• But, illegal immigrants will not be deported — won't happen.
• And a two language nation (like Canada) may very well evolve here.
• Meanwhile, the growing illegal population grows the underground economy.
• And the underground economy is a drain on the national economy.
• A massive subculture is the last thing we need.
• Presently, most illegals live in poverty.
• And people living in poverty are a big Democrat constituancy.
• Illegals, by definition, are fugitives.
• And more and more fugitives will cause more and more problems.
• Therefore, they will be legalized (via amnesty) and they will become voters.
• They will also become tax payers and many will feel the same way about taxes as you and I do.
• Both Bush, and now Gephardt, are "correct" — because it's going to happen.
• The longer it takes, the better the Democrats like it and the more they benefit.
• Which is unfortunate because many Hispanics are not averse to Republican ideals.
• Wishful thinking is a real bummer.
• How many potential voters are we talking about?
• No party can afford to concede that many votes.
• How are we going to deal with this new reality to the benefit of America?

13 posted on 08/03/2002 11:12:10 AM PDT by Consort
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To: Jimer
Jimer, while you start off stating the obvious problems with illegal immigration, you then go on to state that we might as well make due with what we have.

As I see it, this course, over the long term, will lead to the same thing as doing nothing, albeit will take longer.

There are only a few possible things that can be done. Take note that what I am about to say is not out of intolerance but of a love for country. I've looked long and hard into the problem, and without a plan that has some "meat", all attempts will be to no avail. Therefore, I'll list what needs to be done.

With regard to the illegal aliens already in the country. If the United States Government made a legitimate push to close the borders, and this includes increasing the border patrol 500-1000% or using the military on the borders and only the borders, then we may be able to get a handle on things. That is, if we make sure that our number one priority is our line of defense, then way may not have to go about rounding up illegals.

I would concur that every car be inspected at all border crossings. I am mainly referring to the border crossings with Mexico, for Canadians aren't slipping into our country left and right. Though I do think that border security should be strenthened with the Canadian border. The U.S. Government should put the word out several months to implementation that border checks will become mandatory until otherwise stated. If a worker happens to live in Mexico and works in the United States, and vice versa, they would be eligible to apply for a everyday cross passport with stipulations that he/she is the only person that shall be allowed to pass. Anyone else within the car, will not be admitted. Furthermore, passes will have to be checked monthly to assure that illegals aren't moving into the United States.

The hope is that border crossings will become so complicated that most residents will decide to stay within their own countries and find work there. In fact, daily border crossings have been one of the problems in debacling this whole mess. The goal is self sufficiency.

Meanwhile, the U.S. should pull out of NAFTA, GATT, and tell the Mexican Government that they will have to deal with their own people. Again, self sufficiency.

The last thing that should be done, short of rounding up illegals at their homes, would be to increase the INS in the interior, of which a program will be set in place with a set start and end time. The word will be given out six months in advance to members of certain industries that have been known to hire illegals, that inspections of work sites will begin and will end two to five years later. The inspections will be random, and that each employee should have valid documentation, including a green card, social security card, Immigration documentation, work visa, birth certificate, etc. If the employee is found without certified documentation, or if there is substantial evidence to prove that he/she is in the country illegally, then the worker will face automatic deportation, of which he/she, including illegal family members, will be deported within five days to two weeks. If an employer has been found to have breached the law, he/she will have to pay an expansive fine and possibly face jail time. The goal is that hiring illegals will become too much of risk or burden to employers, that hiring illegals will not be an option.

As you can see, with increased border enforcement, increased interior enforcement, US government speech to Mexican government, withdrawal from NAFT and GATT, along with automatic fines and deportations, the problems would likely subside, as many illegals would deport themselves, many would stop coming, as they would increasingly be caught, not to mention that the economic incentive would subside.

A couple of other helpful tools would be the prohibition of welfare and certain social services for Illegals, not to mention the prohibition of the "anchor baby" amendment.

47 posted on 08/03/2002 7:41:02 PM PDT by FreedomFriend
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To: Jimer
Jimer, while you start off stating the obvious problems with illegal immigration, you then go on to state that we might as well make due with what we have.

As I see it, this course, over the long term, will lead to the same thing as doing nothing, albeit will take longer.

There are only a few possible things that can be done. Take note that what I am about to say is not out of intolerance but of a love for country. I've looked long and hard into the problem, and without a plan that has some "meat", all attempts will be to no avail. Therefore, I'll list what needs to be done.

With regard to the illegal aliens already in the country. If the United States Government made a legitimate push to close the borders, and this includes increasing the border patrol 500-1000% or using the military on the borders and only the borders, then we may be able to get a handle on things. That is, if we make sure that our number one priority is our line of defense, then way may not have to go about rounding up illegals.

I would concur that every car be inspected at all border crossings. I am mainly referring to the border crossings with Mexico, for Canadians aren't slipping into our country left and right. Though I do think that border security should be strenthened with the Canadian border. The U.S. Government should put the word out several months to implementation that border checks will become mandatory until otherwise stated. If a worker happens to live in Mexico and works in the United States, and vice versa, they would be eligible to apply for a everyday cross passport with stipulations that he/she is the only person that shall be allowed to pass. Anyone else within the car, will not be admitted. Furthermore, passes will have to be checked monthly to assure that illegals aren't moving into the United States.

The hope is that border crossings will become so complicated that most residents will decide to stay within their own countries and find work there. In fact, daily border crossings have been one of the problems in debacling this whole mess. The goal is self sufficiency.

Meanwhile, the U.S. should pull out of NAFTA, GATT, and tell the Mexican Government that they will have to deal with their own people. Again, self sufficiency.

The last thing that should be done, short of rounding up illegals at their homes, would be to increase the INS in the interior, of which a program will be set in place with a set start and end time. The word will be given out six months in advance to members of certain industries that have been known to hire illegals, that inspections of work sites will begin and will end two to five years later. The inspections will be random, and that each employee should have valid documentation, including a green card, social security card, Immigration documentation, work visa, birth certificate, etc. If the employee is found without certified documentation, or if there is substantial evidence to prove that he/she is in the country illegally, then the worker will face automatic deportation, of which he/she, including illegal family members, will be deported within five days to two weeks. If an employer has been found to have breached the law, he/she will have to pay an expansive fine and possibly face jail time. The goal is that hiring illegals will become too much of risk or burden to employers, that hiring illegals will not be an option.

As you can see, with increased border enforcement, increased interior enforcement, US government speech to Mexican government, withdrawal from NAFT and GATT, along with automatic fines and deportations, the problems would likely subside, as many illegals would deport themselves, many would stop coming, as they would increasingly be caught, not to mention that the economic incentive would subside.

A couple of other helpful tools would be the prohibition of welfare and certain social services for Illegals, not to mention the prohibition of the "anchor baby" amendment.

48 posted on 08/03/2002 7:41:21 PM PDT by FreedomFriend
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