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'You Betrayed The Motherland' (China)
feer ^ | Jiang Xueqin

Posted on 07/31/2002 11:48:38 PM PDT by maui_hawaii

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1 posted on 07/31/2002 11:48:38 PM PDT by maui_hawaii
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To: Hopalong; JohnHuang2; soccer8
bump
2 posted on 07/31/2002 11:51:20 PM PDT by maui_hawaii
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To: Alamo-Girl; Jeff Head; tallhappy
bump
3 posted on 07/31/2002 11:54:00 PM PDT by maui_hawaii
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To: PhilDragoo; Captainpaintball; Tailgunner Joe
bump
4 posted on 08/01/2002 12:00:54 AM PDT by maui_hawaii
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Comment #5 Removed by Moderator

To: maui_hawaii
Hope he got his wife out before he wrote this.
6 posted on 08/01/2002 12:22:12 AM PDT by piasa
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To: ENLIGHTENED_TRUTH
THE POOREST PEOPLE OF AMERICA (WELFARE QUEENS) HAVE ALSO ALREADY JOINED HANDS WITH THE LEADERS OF THE CHINESE COMMUNISTS TO HELP USHER IN A NEW WORLD ORDER OF WORLDWIDE COMMUNISM.

And the middle class too...

It is every American's responsibility for wanting the cheapest products no matter the human cost, and for pricing our own products out of the market with excessive taxation and excessive government mandated regulation. It is everyone's responsibility when we elect people who say nothing to China about human rights out of fear of blackmail or because they eally need some of that campaign cash from those 'monks.'

That said, communism will collapse in China just as it did in Russia. While they recover, Americans will probably stupidly increase the amount of socialism just as the Europeans have done.

7 posted on 08/01/2002 12:32:28 AM PDT by piasa
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To: maui_hawaii
they don't have the right to go and block traffic, break into offices and disrupt work. These workers are lazy, and in the past did nothing but expected everything. Now the world's changed, and society only rewards those who contribute to its economic development. Your average American business owner couldn't have said it better himself. But these are the quoted words of an average Chinese policeman. The capitalist ethos is sweeping China. The author of this article actually seems like a Marxist. He would prefer that China actually not lay off any workers from China's state-owned industries but continue to keep them employed forever in a communist, centrally-planned economy. The author actually seems to prefer an inefficient communist welfare state! But common sense says that in order for China to become less communist and more capitalist, laying off workers at China's inefficient, state-owned industries is a necessary step. It's strange to hear, though, some people actually prefer that China try to maintain a communist, centrally-planned economy forever, based on huge, inefficient, state-owned industries.
8 posted on 08/01/2002 12:46:33 AM PDT by AIG
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To: ENLIGHTENED_TRUTH
You mean "worldwide capitalism."
9 posted on 08/01/2002 12:47:12 AM PDT by AIG
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To: piasa
While they recover, Americans will probably stupidly increase the amount of socialism just as the Europeans have done.

No doubt! America is becoming more communist as we speak while China is trying to become more capitalist. Laying off workers from state-owned industries is an essential step in China's move to capitalism. Some Americans, though, would prefer that China stick to a communist economic system and not lay off any workers at inefficient, state-owned, centrally-planned, communist industries at all!

10 posted on 08/01/2002 12:50:22 AM PDT by AIG
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To: AIG
China may be adopting some capitalism, but it has yet to become more free. I think you mistook much of what I said. China cannot become a truly capitalistic and free state until it has freedom of speech, because with a lack of freely flowing information on economic as well as political issues, the economic decisions of entrepreneurs will be based on something little more solid than cold mountain air. In other words, people will buy and sell more fiction than real marketable goods or services. We saw a similar thing in a few companies in our markets- with one accounting firm pretty much handling things, it was easy for the shortfall of sources of information to morph into propaganda about how well certain companies were doing. No one could check the information. Our system has a way of fixing that, though. Ultimately, enough information slipped out to break the illusion. Now, for people who were paying attention, it was obvious that certain stocks were overvalued. But this was because at least some data was correct and honest data.

There are no checks and balances in China, there is no press to report on companies or on the government, and even if there were, the government is not designed to correct itself since it is designed to entrench itself even further. There are no real elections at the national level and no competing party, so there is no self-policing going on, no appeals for poor decisions. This is NOT capitalism.

The market value of one's company or other property in China really is unverifiable. So long as the government is content to play, everyone thinks they own something but they are never going to be sure of just how valuable are the holdings. How do you know when to sell when the government can arbitrarily change the rules and devalue your stocks to '0' in order for party official 'A' to get a good deal, and you have no legal recourse for an appeal? If the government changes arbitrarily to a copy of North Korea's or Cuba's systems of flaming red idiocy, all is lost, with little or no warning. Instant wealth redistribution can occur at the drop of a hat.

Property rights are meaningless if you have no way of determining the true worth of what you own- and it is even more meaningless if the government can take those rights away, as China can do with absolute ease. Its system is not one of checks and balances. The corporations that are there are there entirely at the whim of a few men at the top who, incidently, answer to no one, except someone who is able to unseat them by force.

12 posted on 08/01/2002 3:03:29 AM PDT by piasa
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To: *China stuff
Index Bump
13 posted on 08/01/2002 8:13:14 AM PDT by Free the USA
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To: maui_hawaii
Thanks for the ping.

This forced confession, "I have betrayed my own blood...." says it all.

The ChiCom view is a Nazi world view based on blood.

14 posted on 08/01/2002 9:12:03 AM PDT by tallhappy
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To: piasa
China is not adopting Capitalism. It is Socialism with Chinese Characteristics.

AIG is a liar and distorter. His forst post here is complete distortion and lies.

He's disruptor of the most basic type trying to 1) fool by lies, 2) waste people's time by making us re-invent the wheel over and over and make the same arguments over and over to their ludicrous, distorted dishonest propaganda.

Ann Coulter describes the methods so well in Slander

See China's disguised failure for a concise review. It includes these very descriptive comments:

Many foreigners think, mistakenly, that China is capitalist. In fact, China's system is exactly what its leaders call it: socialism with Chinese characteristics. In practice, that means a large state sector, party committees even in private enterprises, corporate boards that are unable to fire managers, no market for corporate control and massive changes in economic policy (such as consolidation of the motor industry) dictated without consultation.

Now, see. I've already taken time out to address a lying ChiCom propgandists lies.

That is what a disruptor does.

15 posted on 08/01/2002 9:20:35 AM PDT by tallhappy
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To: maui_hawaii; tallhappy
Thanks for the bump. This was a very good, interesting article. My favorite part:

A Chinese reporter can go to news conferences and receive red envelopes to pay for his mortgage, or he can risk his job by writing about the peasant who has just lost his land. A Western reporter can stay in his air-conditioned luxury apartment, cull the Chinese newspapers for stories and attend a cocktail with China's bold and beautiful in the evening, or he can venture out on dirt roads into villages where peasants--fearful of retribution--will keep their door closed and their mouth shut.

Tall - AIG/latourette will never learn...they just keep playing the 'same old song'.

16 posted on 08/01/2002 3:41:45 PM PDT by batter
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To: antiLiberalCrusader
"Why don't we just take these chicom [sic] bastards out now while we[']re still more powerful than them [sic]? You guys do know that the SDI which is suposedly [sic] meant for "roge [sic] states" is really meant for China's relitively [sic] small nuclear arsenal. THis [sic] situation reminds me of what Patton said about the Russians in '45[:] "We're gonna have to fight em' [sic] sometime anyway[,] why not do it now while we have the army here to do it with?" Just think what the 20th century would have been like had we heeded Patton's words and permited [sic] him to drive the [S]oviets from Eastern Europe."

Yes, let's start a world-ending nuclear war, rather than waiting a few years for Communism to collapse. Better yet, let's just MIND OUR OWN BUSINESS!!!

Maybe you should spend less time displaying your astounding ignorance here and more time learning English.

17 posted on 08/01/2002 4:06:33 PM PDT by Conagher
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To: maui_hawaii
"When the Daqing interrogators directed that camera at me, and asked me to make my confession I took a deep breath. This masquerade was only a bad Chinese counterfeit of Stalin's show trials, I thought to myself. And I read the script, and contributed to the masquerade".

If he hadn't, he probably wouldn't be around to mention this incident.They then went on to interrogate his wife for 5 hours.Sheesh.What a fascinating look at China. Just another glaring example of a Communist Dictatorship in action.Unfortunately,this story will not and could not appear in any Major US Newspaper either.

18 posted on 08/01/2002 4:34:05 PM PDT by Pagey
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To: tallhappy; maui_hawaii
I hadn't encountered AIG before so I didn't know his or her habits, but I guessed as much from the programmed party line enthusiams in his post.

Does he ever answer and is he a reincarnation of someone we know?

19 posted on 08/01/2002 5:55:10 PM PDT by piasa
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Comment #20 Removed by Moderator


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