Posted on 07/19/2002 1:59:31 PM PDT by Charles Henrickson
Edited on 04/23/2004 12:04:39 AM PDT by Jim Robinson. [history]
You would think that the more militant forms of Islam would be enough to worry about these days, for those inclined to anguish over religious extremism. But no. Apparently the Lutheran Church-Missouri Synod deserves our special concern. In late June, the church suspended the Rev. David Benke, the president of its Atlantic District and the pastor of a Brooklyn church, for praying with clerics who don't share the Christian faith.
(Excerpt) Read more at opinionjournal.com ...
I am the pastor of Emmaus Lutheran Church in Ridgewood, Queens. We are located about 2 miles from the site of the former World Trade Center. On the morning of September 11, I was in the parish hall setting up for a Winkel. When the first tower fell, not only did I hear the collapse, but (because we are so close to "ground zero") the church building itself "shuddered." My secretary immediately turned on the radio to hear what was going on. We knew that something terrible had happened because the "M" subway train that runs past the church had stopped running. Everything was eerily quiet -- an uncommon thing in Ridgewood!
Four of my members escaped that day from the devastation in lower Manhattan. I will not here recount their trauma, but suffice it to say that our parish has been forever changed by the events of September 11. On Friday of that week, in response to Pres. Bush's request, we held a prayer service, and invited the entire Ridgewood community.
Several weeks afterward, one of those in attendance at the service began coming to worship at Emmaus. He indicated a desire to become a member of our congregation, and I enrolled him in our "Inquirer's Class." In the meantime, "A Prayer for America" had been broadcast, and my new catechumen watched it on television.
Several weeks into the course, we came upon question 196 in the new "blue catechism": "Whose prayers are acceptable to God?" The answer -- "Only those who believe in Jesus Christ may pray and to God and expect to be heard" -- gave my student great offense. Citing Pres. Benke's appearance at Yankee Stadium, he wanted to know if I believed that only the prayers of Christians are heard by God. I answered that this is indeed true. He then demanded to know why, if this is so, a bishop of the LCMS could appear on the podium with clerics of many other religions and imply that the prayers of all people are heard. He himself firmly held to that opinion, and asserted that my position (as opposed to that demonstrated - as he believed - by Pres. Benke) was narrow and sectarian. Even though we engaged in several hour-long discussions about the fact that Christ alone is the Way and the Truth and the Life, my student finally withdrew from the class. He could not accept that the worship of other gods is sinful, and sadly (and with much regret) stopped worshiping at Emmaus. I am able to share this story with you because my former student shared it with members of my congregation; I am therefore not violating any confidence.
Now . . . about what we are doing to reach out to the lost: We -- at a small, struggling parish in NYC directly affected by the disaster -- are attempting to reach the lost with the Truth. And that Truth is Jesus Christ our Lord. We will not dilute or becloud that Truth with any falsehood; that is, with any suggestion that all religions are the same, and that they all lead to salvation. The example cited above is indicative of much of what has happened here since 9/11/01. Many people are searching for the answers to life's questions, but few indeed are willing to hear them. We at Emmaus proclaim in Scripture, Sacrament, liturgy and song that Jesus Christ alone is Lord. This faith has sustained and strengthened those members of our parish who endured first-hand the events of 9/11. And they would not have it any other way.
The Rev. John A. Stoudt
Pastor of Emmaus Ev. Lutheran Church
Counselor of Circuit 7
Atlantic District, LCMS
I would add only those that have repented and are in right relationship with God are heard....people do not like to think God is not Barney
Conclusion by egarvue:
"One thing I didn't know, but do now, is that BENKE WAS NEVER INVITED TO THE SERVICE!!!!!! He had to lobby to be included, and when he showed up a the service, his name wasn't on the cleared list. ...What a glory-seeking, lying, Clintonesque scum!"
A rather clear case of a false conclusion there egarvue based on this reporter's poor grasp of the facts...some would even call it yellow journalism. She slightly misinterprets the facts which leads to the demeaning false conclusion that Pastor Benke had to beg to get invited, "lobby to be included" and then "sneaked onto the field".
Believe what you want I guess, it's a free Country as they say, but her rendering of the events does not jive with Rev. Benke's account. Rev. Benke clearly says he was asked.
The venue for this civic event had to be changed from the wide open Central Park to the more secure Yankee Stadium. Recall this was a very scary time in our Nation's history. Admission to Yankee Stadium now required a ticket as part of the security clearance.
Here's where the author injects a falsehood that leads to her odd conclusion.
The phone calls made by Benke were in search of the ticket, not to lobby for his inclusion. He was already supposed to be on the guest list but he says there was a mix up in the security roster. He made some phone calls but never did get it straightened out before the service was to begin. So, to get onto the stage with the others he held onto Cardinal Egan's arm and gained entrance.
This does not mean that he "lobbied to be included" to me....unless that's what you want it to mean. His name was listed in the program, so I'd tend to believe his account over this rather strident reporter.
Why don't we go with the facts?
Yes, let's do, shall we? Ziegler writes:
. . . Mr. Benke, by his own admission, lobbied the event's sponsors for an invitation. When unsuccessful, he sneaked onto the field by joining Cardinal Edward Egan.
So let's ask these three questions:
Did Benke lobby for an invitation?
Was he unsuccessful?
Did he sneak on the field by joining Cardinal Egan?
Now let's look at the evidence. Here are Benke's own words, from his web page, Response to Charges (bolding added):
Under "Thursday, September 20," Benke writes:
. . . I determined to make a phone call to a Roman Catholic contact about the September 23 event. When I asked about the event in Central Park, he said, “Oh, that’s ancient history. With all the security issues, it’s been moved to Yankee Stadium. You’ll need a ticket to get in through security. That’s designed to keep attendance to those who really need to be there.” I made a series of phone calls. By mid-afternoon these conversations resulted in the opportunity to participate in the program at Yankee Stadium and to offer a prayer.
And under "Sunday, September 23," Benke writes:
Travel and transit did turn out to be an adventure; first of all, it took almost two hours to get through the web of security with our bus into Yankee Stadium, even though we were pre-screened. The religious participants were held in the Yankee locker room, while the politicians and celebrities were in the visitors’ quarters. Then the FBI representative read off the list of approved participants, and my name was not on it – whoops! I went to the Protestant portion leader, who thought that maybe I should just wait in the dugout when the rest went out and they would call me later. I started to laugh, because I had this vision of being kind of the pinch-hitter’s pinch-hitter, strolling out to pray with a bat in my hands. But I resolved that I would need to accompany the rest up to the bleacher area out on the field. I spent some time with Roman Catholic friends Bishop Daley and Cardinal Egan, discussing Pro-Life issues (Cardinal O’Connor and I had co-founded a crisis pregnancy center in Manhattan under the great direction of a team of Roman Catholic and Lutheran laywomen). Then I took the Cardinal’s arm and walked out from the dugout onto the playing field. What were they going to do, throw me off the field? As the celebrities and politicians emerged, the usually congealed situation took place, and we all inched out toward second base. Eventually they found me a chair, sitting next to the Commander of the Atlantic Fleet.
So now let's return to those three questions:
Did Benke lobby for an invitation? Answer: Yes.
Was he unsuccessful? Answer: No, for the invitation. Yes, for being cleared to go on the field.
Did he sneak on the field by joining Cardinal Egan? Answer: Yes. In spite of the fact that the FBI did not have him on their list of approved participants. In spite of the fact that the Protestant leader told him to wait in the dugout. In spite of the fact that they did not have a chair reserved for him on the platform. Those are facts that Benke himself admits to.
If there is confusion about the invitation, etc., that is due to Benke's lack of clarity in his account, on which Ziegler apparently relied. Benke is very good at being unclear.
Now a final question: Is this the best you can do to refute Ziegler's main argument in the article?
You don't get your name on the program if you're not an invited guest. You don't get your name on the program if you just sneaked in. You don't get your name on the program if you breached security. Don't waste your words trying to impugn his character with his own words no less, unless you can address that issue.
How did he get his name on the program if he was an uninvited guest?
Sure they do.
My problem stems from the idea that anyone would oppose the coming together, regardless of faith, in praying to our Father in a time of need.
Their denomination teaches to be separate from the rest of us Christians, that they alone are worthy of praying and that only in the public presence with others like themselves.
I guess this makes them feel better, more special. They probably don't want to be contaminated by the rest of us.
I'm sure my Jewish friends would love the "Christianity" shown in the 27 posts in this thread which were here when I started this post.
Oh yes! these separatistic Christians make a great winsome impression with their cold form of holiness.
The Disciples of Christ have become a lot more liberal in their interpretation of "who is qualified" to take Communion - it's now "all believers", rather than "those who have been baptised by immersion". However, they have not waivered in their belief that Communion has more to do with fellowship with God on Earth than with sucking down blood or engaging in cannibalism.
Interesting that there is still doctrinal conflict between the Lutherans and the Calvinists! In fact, from the Calvinist point of view, most all of Mr. Benke's critics are not really Christians because they fail to trust in God's Grace and seek, instead, to substitute fallible human judgment and traditions (in a highly organized and regulated fashion, of course!)
One might imagine, if we listened to the other guys all the time, that we are all going to Hell. I suggested Mr. Benke's change in church membership so that if he is, in fact, going to Hell, he will be more relaxed about it. Certainly many members of his present denomination will be relieved as well.
Your claims to the contrary are a gross and egregious misrepresentation.
The Lutheran perspective would not include either of these two positions, every Sunday is a feast day in which the death and resurrection of Jesus is celebrated, every Sunday an Easter. Lutherans have always defended the Communion form those who would deny the incarnation, it could be no other way. The saving power in the blood was that it was God made flesh.
I suggested Mr. Benke's change in church membership…
People are frail and prone to sin, Mr. Bemke should seek forgiveness and return to what he found good and right so many years ago.
Of course he would. He met with all types of people. But I bet they would be "offended" by His Gospel message.
What I'd like to know is how it is that the Indo-European peoples made their big split as long as 5,000 years ago yet the Brahmin ideal of only a small elect being "saved" is still resident in portions of the West, and in Christian dress to boot?
You folks who are upset with the conservative LCMS members are forgetting that this service included muslims, buddists, and sihks....so your argument of LCMS clergy getting in trouble for simply praying with fellow Christians is invalid.
While God loves each of us enough to send His Son to save us, He hates sin. Our Lord can forgive Benke, and I can too, but he needs to admit and repent of his sin.
Am I any better than Benke or anyone who participates in these services? No, but their sin is more visible than many of mine are. I know that I sin daily and need forgivenss. A pastor is most definately held to a higher standard because he is a leader and eternal salvation is in the balance.
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