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The March of the Porcelain Soldiers
Soldiers For The Truth ^ | Prior to 9/11 | David Hackworth

Posted on 07/05/2002 5:10:33 AM PDT by CIBvet

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To: WhiskeyPapa
From;

http://www.history.navy.mil/birthday.htm

Navy Birthday Information - 13 October 1775

The Chief of Naval Operations has stated that the Navy Birthday is one of the two Navy wide dates to be celebrated annually. This page provides historical information on the birth and early years of the Navy, including bibliographies, lists of the ships, and information on the first officers of the Continental Navy, as well as texts of original documents relating to Congress and the Continental Navy, 1775-1783.

The United States Navy traces its origins to the Continental Navy, which the Continental Congress established on 13 October 1775 by authorizing the procurement, fitting out, manning, and dispatch of two armed vessels to cruise in search of munitions ships supplying the British Army in America. The legislation also established a Naval Committee to supervise the work. All together, the Continental Navy numbered some fifty ships over the course of the war, with approximately twenty warships active at its maximum strength.

After the American War for Independence, Congress sold the surviving ships of the Continental Navy and released the seamen and officers. The Constitution of the United States, ratified in 1789, empowered Congress "to provide and maintain a navy." Acting on this authority, Congress ordered the construction and manning of six frigates in 1794, and the War Department administered naval affairs from that year until Congress established the Department of the Navy on 30 April 1798.

Not to be confused with the Navy Birthday or the founding of the Navy Department is Navy Day. The Navy League sponsored the first national observance of Navy Day in 1922 designed to give recognition to the naval service. The Navy League of New York proposed that the official observance be on 27 October in honor of President Theodore Roosevelt, who had been born on that day.

In 1972 Chief of Naval Operations (CNO) Admiral Elmo R. Zumwalt authorized recognition of 13 October as the Navy's birthday. In contrast to Navy Day, the Navy Birthday is intended as an internal activity for members of the active forces and reserves, as well as retirees, and dependents. Since 1972 each CNO has encouraged a Navy-wide celebration of this occasion "to enhance a greater appreciation of our Navy heritage, and to provide a positive influence toward pride and professionalism in the naval service."

This page is intended to support Navy commands in appropriate commemorations of the Navy's birthday."

Zumwalt chops were really busted. No way can a bastard son of the navy be older!

From the sub-menu;

Please notice that the first CiC was Esek Hopkins, Commander in Chief, 22 Dec. 1775

101 posted on 07/05/2002 1:28:33 PM PDT by 68 grunt
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To: WhiskeyPapa
I spoke with an Army recruiter before I joined the Corps. He spent over 2 hours telling me everything the Army could offer me and what I could do in the Army.

A day or two later I spoke to a Marine recruiter. He explained the Corps to me for about 15 minutes, detailing the difficulty involve in making it thru boot camp, then looked at me and asked if I thought I could handle it.

I signed up that very day!
102 posted on 07/05/2002 1:29:49 PM PDT by dpa5923
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To: dpa5923
And if one of my Marines asks a LtCol about a damn dental appointment, I would kill him. Just the way it is.

I have a pretty cool "Old Corps"anecdote to relate.

It was my pleasure to meet General Alvin Shoffner, who was a lieutenant in the 4th Marines. It fell to him to actually seek out some Japs to surrender to on Corregidor. Later, he escaped, and was a battalion commander on Okinawa. He was a real character.

He told us that when he was a new lieutenant in the 4th Marines he held a platoon inspection; one of the Marines was not quite up to snuff and he told his platoon sergeant, "you need to shine this guy up a bit."

The next time he saw this private he had two black eyes! Shiners!

Walt

103 posted on 07/05/2002 1:36:55 PM PDT by WhiskeyPapa
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To: tlrugit
And I would shake your hand AND buy you a brewski! (As many as you want!!)

Thank you!

Semper Fi

104 posted on 07/05/2002 1:52:11 PM PDT by JoeSixPack1
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To: CIBvet
I was Air Force in the 70's and 80's.
Got knocked on my ass by Tsgt. Fury our lead T.I..
He had a scar on the right side of his mouth from a charging handle on a M-16.
Kinda made him look like he was smiling.
HE WASN'T

The biggest lesson I taught my sons was
Never Date The Base Commanders Daughter! No matter how cute she is.
(in my best forrest gump voice) And that's all I can say about that. LOL
FReegards
105 posted on 07/05/2002 3:32:52 PM PDT by WhirlwindAttack
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To: CIBvet
Thank you for the ping.
106 posted on 07/05/2002 9:24:44 PM PDT by Snow Bunny
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To: Prodigal Son
Our Seargent Major literally assigned Lieutenants and Captains to sh!t details in Bosnia and there was virtually nothing they could do about it- easier to do the demeaning "latrine guard" than try to pit their two years of military experience against the Seargent Major's 20.

First of all, Captains have at least 4 years of exeperience, not counting pre commisioning time, which is most probably 4 years of full or part time training. Many of them are prior enlisted too, but with less officer training time. The Sargent Major is supposed to be training those junior officers, without really seeming to be doing so. At least that's what Air Force Chiefs do, and by all reports Navy Chiefs too. I'm sure from the perspective of a junior to mid level enlisted troop, or even junior officer, it seems the Chiefs (or Sgt. Majors or Gunnies) run the servie, but they don't. Not on a policy level, nor on a tactical level beyond the very small unit level. When you get right down to it, the officer's job is to make decisions. Little ones at first, big ones later, if he proves up to it.

Each service has a somewhat different culture, because they have different missions and/or operate under different conditions.

BTW, while Hack does have his points, he is extremly sceptical of anything not painted Army, or sometimes Marine, Green. He has no use for the Air Force, and little for the Navy. He should remember that in both Korea and Vietnam, US ground forces were never attacked from the air, Thanks to the AF and Navy, who were off doing their fighter pilot thing, while Hack thought they should be hitting the troops right in front of him!

107 posted on 07/05/2002 10:40:13 PM PDT by El Gato
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To: WhiskeyPapa
It just seems -really- odd that you can't produce the written mission of the Army rifle squad.

What? I keep it up my yazoo or something? What do you think their mission would be- collecting daisies or what?

But lookie here- FM 7-8 the mission of the Infantry:

The mission of the infantry is to close with the enemy by means of fire and maneuver to defeat or capture him, or to repel his assault by fire, close combat, and counterattack.

108 posted on 07/05/2002 10:56:31 PM PDT by Prodigal Son
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To: dpa5923
We are younger than the Navy, but march in a senior position to her.

Marines are part of the Navy, and AFAIK, always have been. So order of March is an internal affair within the Naval Department. That Admiral (Decater maybe?) couldn't have bummped you in front of the Army, nor could an Air Force general bump us tail end charlies up the pecking order. We'll be tail end charlie until the US Space Force is created. :)

109 posted on 07/05/2002 10:59:41 PM PDT by El Gato
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To: bat-boy
They are going to die because PC was more important to the brass than ensuring their soldiers train to fight.

PC is part of the problem. The bigger problem is numbers. Every echelon in the Army is under extreme pressure to fill slots with people. Because of that, the quality of the people becomes a secondary issue. It would be far better for the Army to fail miserably to meet its strength figures than to permit substandard soldiers to fill the ranks.

110 posted on 07/05/2002 11:44:32 PM PDT by arm958
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To: Prodigal Son
But lookie here- FM 7-8 the mission of the Infantry:

The mission of the infantry is to close with the enemy by means of fire and maneuver to defeat or capture him, or to repel his assault by fire, close combat, and counterattack.

I see that it took you 12 hours to find it. Are you in the infantry? Were you?

I think the Marine Corps still knows what it is about. I am not so sure the Army does.

That latter would be the import of Hackworth's article too.

Walt

111 posted on 07/06/2002 6:52:02 AM PDT by WhiskeyPapa
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To: El Gato
Marines are part of the Navy, and AFAIK, always have been. So order of March is an internal affair within the Naval Department.

Check out #96 in this thread.

Walt

112 posted on 07/06/2002 6:53:03 AM PDT by WhiskeyPapa
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To: WhiskeyPapa
I see that it took you 12 hours to find it. Are you in the infantry? Were you?

Where was I? In a different time zone in bed asleep ;-) (Scotland)

113 posted on 07/06/2002 12:27:40 PM PDT by Prodigal Son
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To: WhiskeyPapa
I am a Marine Sergeant stationed alongside Recruit Depot Parris Island, SC. I have the oppurtunity to see what the Corps is graduating, not to mention what hits the streets in our Fleet. I can assure you that our newest Marines leave PI. squared away, but there is always that 10 percent.

"These young people today are not the same calibur of recruits as my generation," is a common statement of the generations serving before us. I am the fourth generation of my family to serve the Marine Corps. My experiences do not mirror those of any that came before me, other than the fact that we all stood on the same parade field and earned the title Marine. It is the current policies of our Armed Forces that makes us different.

My grandfather would have to get a special Liberty Pass to go out in town during the 40's. I can leave the base at anytime of the day. My father was drafted into the Army, but enlisted in the Marine Corps. I was ready to join when I was ten.

The mind set of the average American teenager is not of service to his country. It is a trait that needs to come back. The services are looking for these few, motivated individuals. The services are putting out commercials that say they have the most to offer, or are the best. The individual that walks into a recruitors office or responds to the presence of a recruitor is a hot commodity.

It is tough to be a recruitor. They are torn between putting the best possible candidates into service, and meeting the enlistment goals of the branch of service they work for. Once signed, they have no idea how this individual will perform in recruit training. It is now up to the Drill Instructor to mold this individual into a well disciplined team player.

There is always that ten percent. Some are Sick Bay Commandos, others say they lied on there enlistment package to get kicked out, and others just volunteered for the wrong job. It could be worse. They could all be conscripts that feel no allegiance to our country, or the values we live by.

Those undesireables that make it to the Fleet have to deal with Marines Like me. It is my job to develop them, train them, and look out for there welfare. We have a motto that I live by. It is "Semper Fidelis!" Always Faithful.

God Speed Ted Williams, and God Bless America.

Sgt Karkota

The 241 that dies in Beirut was a dircet result of politics, not training. Just look into the Rules of Engagement for Force Protection.
114 posted on 07/06/2002 6:21:17 PM PDT by Patriot_carcass
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To: Patriot_carcass
Semper Fi bump ... nice post to an interesting thread
115 posted on 07/06/2002 7:54:57 PM PDT by fnord
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To: El Gato
First of all, Captains have at least 4 years of exeperience, not counting pre commisioning time,

Not so. Because of a supposed shortage of captains, that rank is now attained in thirty something months, I think thirty-six.

116 posted on 07/09/2002 11:20:58 AM PDT by Stingray51
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