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CNBC: Massive fraud at WorldCom -- Earnings inflated
MSNBC ^ | 6/25/02

Posted on 06/25/2002 3:41:04 PM PDT by Brian Mosely

CNBC: Massive fraud at WorldCom -- Earnings inflated


TOPICS: Breaking News; Business/Economy; Crime/Corruption; News/Current Events
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To: dubyaismypresident
EBIDTA is pure cashflow before interest and taxes. Net Income is riddled with accounting subjectivitness like depreciation estimates and goodwill right-offs. If one lies about their revenues then their EBITDA and Net Income, and Earnings per share are all false.

So what you're saying is, if there's shenanigans going on, ALL the numbers are going to be false on their face, no matter which way you slice them?

41 posted on 06/25/2002 4:18:23 PM PDT by Timesink
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To: Timesink
So what you're saying is, if there's shenanigans going on, ALL the numbers are going to be false on their face, no matter which way you slice them?

All MCI Worldcom's numbers, based on this article, will have to be restated any which way you slice them.

42 posted on 06/25/2002 4:22:13 PM PDT by NeoCaveman
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To: parsifal
I'm not an accountant, but a financier.We should hear if the expenditures were for a network build-out, or to do with how revenues were booked and the the expenses incurred in booking sales.Laying fiber optic cable is different from sales of unused capacity on their phone network.It would be better if the bright spark at CNBC had waited a bit before gushing about "massive fraud".

The other possibility is how goodwill has been amortized and the EPS diluted as WCOM has grown primarily by acquisition.That is always a fertile field for those that wish to manage" earnings growth.
43 posted on 06/25/2002 4:23:18 PM PDT by habs4ever
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To: jrlc
Of course it's the Clinton Legacy. But I wonder how many of these "news organizations" were reporting all this on those hyped, bloated, fraudulent dot coms that were out their making the "Clinton Economic Boom"? Now that he's gone, they can report the facts again. Yawn....
44 posted on 06/25/2002 4:24:57 PM PDT by Alas Babylon!
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To: Brian Mosely
Man. My only stake in the market is my 401K. Back in the spring I changed my election and put more back into stocks, having been heavily into bonds for a while. I am thinking I might want to move my money back over to bonds for a while. What do I know? But this looks like the market could really get dragged down a bit. That's certainly the trend lately. And then if there is another attack soon...
45 posted on 06/25/2002 4:27:30 PM PDT by Huck
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To: Skip Ripley
Below 9/11 levels? Do realize that even then the PE ratios were averaging over 30 to 1. It would take 4500 to equal what was considered a dog stock only 3 years ago (roughly 13 - 1).

Hope you are hungry....

46 posted on 06/25/2002 4:29:04 PM PDT by Thisiswhoweare
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To: Alas Babylon!
Would you also say it is more than a coincidence that this news broke at about the time W arrived in Calgary for the G-8?

I'm not trying to put words in your mouth, you just have me thinking.

47 posted on 06/25/2002 4:31:17 PM PDT by leadpenny
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To: Southack
Regarding the dividend- it is going away. That's already been decided. Tomorrow's will pay out but probably no more.

Also previously announced is a 20% layoff which inside sources say will begin Friday of this week.

Many things going on in the Worldcom camp. I doubt this story is false, although the charge of fraud could potentially wind MSNBC up in court. I have absolutely no doubt whatsoever that Bernie Ebbers is up to his hips in this one.

He was a bag of wind.

48 posted on 06/25/2002 4:33:06 PM PDT by DemoSmear
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To: Brian Mosely
Poor Arthur Andersen, he's got to be spinning in his grave.
49 posted on 06/25/2002 4:35:02 PM PDT by TheDon
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To: Non-Sequitur
Let's see, MCI closed at $1.68 and Worldcom closed at 83 cents. How much lower can this drive the stock?

In after-hours trading on the Island network, WCOM is currently at 27 cents. MCIT is around 80 cents.

Island's 50 after-hours volume leaders look pretty dismal.

50 posted on 06/25/2002 4:35:10 PM PDT by dighton
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To: Southack
ps - why would anyone who bought MCI or WCOM last year panic to sell off? That panic occured last year when they dropped from $65/share to $12/share. After that, every single shareholder I know (quite a few) has simply laughed it off. We've been waiting for the bankruptcy. Worldcom bit off far more than it could chew. Plain and simple. No wonder they had to resort to these kinds of tactics.
51 posted on 06/25/2002 4:36:25 PM PDT by DemoSmear
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To: Brian Mosely
Massive fraud at WorldCom

Why am I not surprised???

52 posted on 06/25/2002 4:37:05 PM PDT by mhking
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To: habs4ever
There's as many fertile fields as there are fertile minds. I always viewed a big set of books as a big opportunity. Most bankers are so dumb that you can run all kinds of stuff right by them. You can footnote stuff and they still don't catch on. Years ago, I doubled revenues at one group of companies by factoring receivables between related companies. I footnoted it and everything. Banker never noticed over a period of many years. It kinda kinked the bottom line as a % of revenues, but durn if there wasn't a lot of money that appeared to be coming in the front door. parsy the ex-accountant.
53 posted on 06/25/2002 4:37:23 PM PDT by parsifal
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To: habs4ever; All
It would be better if the bright spark at CNBC had waited a bit before gushing about "massive fraud".

Actually, I'm betting that the new accountants uncovered a whole can o' worms when they took over from Andersen. The next few months will seem like living under a Centipede, as one shoe ,er, corporation drops after another!!

54 posted on 06/25/2002 4:41:45 PM PDT by Lael
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To: Brian Mosely
Here's another one, going bankrupt, leaving the shareholders holding the bag.

This story is reprinted from the May 28, 2002 edition of SNL Real Estate Securities Weekly.

Does Pinnacle bankruptcy signify wider ills?

A rare thing happened on May 21—a REIT filed for bankruptcy protection. Pinnacle Holdings Inc., which had been suffering for some time, filed voluntary petitions for reorganization under Chapter 11 of the U.S. Bankruptcy Code in the U.S. Bankruptcy Court for the Southern District of New York. While bankruptcies in the REIT world are not unknown, they are unlikely, and the Pinnacle filing is not something to worry REIT investors in general. Rather, the question is whether REIT investors should associate the problems at Pinnacle with the rest of the specialty REITs.

How clear is your crystal ball?

Simply put, Pinnacle invested in paging towers, which turned out to be the wrong sort of communications tower. Paging, thought to be a major growth arena in the early 1990s, failed to compete with cell phones and other more sophisticated devices such as Palm Pilots. To be sure, the REIT recognized its error a few years back and began retrofitting its facilities with cellular-capable equipment, but it could never get out from under the burden of paging tenant bankruptcies. The only lesson to be drawn from the Pinnacle debacle is that one would do well to be clairvoyant. And as this gift is rare, there is very little to be drawn from Pinnacle’s experience. Except…

From time to time, there are flutters of concern about specialty REITs. To begin with, most of these companies did not come public until late in the REIT boom of the 1990s. Where most of today’s REITs came public between 1992 and 1996, most specialty REITs date from 1997 and 1998. When the mini-bubble in REIT share prices burst in 1998, the recently minted specialty REITs were (unfairly) castigated as part of the froth at the top of the market. To be sure, there were some silly-sounding proposals afloat at the time (we have yet to witness the IPO of a graveyard REIT, for example), but for the most part, there is no logical reason for not extending the REIT concept to non-traditional property types, although there are risks.

How to diversify with REITs?

There are several schools of thought on REITs and portfolio diversification. On the one hand, REITs can be thought of as performing the function of a mutual fund manager—REIT shareholders hire their managements to come up with a diversified property portfolio.

Companies like Washington REIT and Colonial Properties Trust exemplify this model. On the other hand, REITs can stick to what they know best—office owners know the office market and should stay out of apartments, in this view. SL Green Realty Corp. is an instance of both property type and geographical specialization. Yet even with offices and apartments, to name two of the most traditional REIT property types, tenant diversification remains a key analytical point. An owner of CBD offices is likely to have tenants engaged in all manner of industries, and the aggregate safety of its rental income benefits from the economic diversity of its tenant base, even though its property type per se is quite uniform.

Questions to ask about specialty REITs

Specialty REITs that deal with single property types within one industry—car dealerships, movie theaters, and so forth—face the additional risk of depending directly on the health of fundamentals in their tenants’ industries. Even though a specialty REIT may be diversified in terms of tenant names, it may still face difficulty if the industry within which its tenants operate experiences a lull or, as we saw with Pinnacle, a devastating fundamental shift in its markets.

For example, Entertainment Properties Trust’s tenants may enjoy robust box office receipts this year, but its reliance on its major tenant, AMC Entertainment, is something to bear in mind. In particular, it is necessary to drill down one’s analysis further to determine AMC’s prospects and Entertainment Properties’ ability to weather any downturn in AMC’s fundamentals. Similarly, Capital Automotive REIT incorporates the risk inherent in the health of the automotive industry.

Opportunities arise as well. Specialty REITs may have, depending on the nature of their properties, certain unique competencies that they can exploit. For example, if a given location becomes unsuitable for car dealers, might it be useful for some other purpose? In Capital Automotive’s case, yes. Several acres of land in the middle of Fairfax County, Virginia, can be used any number of ways.

Such items of note underscore the need for detailed information about these companies and the properties they own. The answer is not to run from specialty REITs simply because Pinnacle went bankrupt. It is important, however, to realize the risks attendant upon investing in these companies.

Specialty REITs aid diversity; Pinnacle not a blemish

Specialty REITs belong in a diversified portfolio. They give investors the opportunity to participate directly in specialty real estate finance, providing the kinds of upside that might not be available in a portfolio of national office properties, where the good, the bad and the ugly are intermingled. Yet, they require more analytical work and present a rather higher risk profile than might a nationally diversified portfolio.

As for Pinnacle, it is in a class by itself, both as a REIT and as a bankruptcy filer. There is no reason to see its experience as a blemish on the REIT industry.

55 posted on 06/25/2002 4:42:15 PM PDT by Donald Stone
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To: dighton
"Let's see, MCI closed at $1.68 and Worldcom closed at 83 cents. How much lower can this drive the stock?"

In after-hours trading on the Island network, WCOM is currently at 27 cents. MCIT is around 80 cents.

I'm waiting for these stocks to actually become negative.

That is, you owe money if you own them.

56 posted on 06/25/2002 4:44:55 PM PDT by Lazamataz
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To: Brian Mosely
Enronitis strikes again.

I'm glad I'm in gold.

57 posted on 06/25/2002 4:46:47 PM PDT by Jethro Tull
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To: Lazamataz
I'm waiting for these stocks to actually become negative.

No, that could only happen to my stocks.

;-)

58 posted on 06/25/2002 4:47:56 PM PDT by dighton
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To: Charlotte Corday
I'll split the difference, we think that 6,000 is about in line with real world of earnings.

That is at current earnings. If the earnings plummet because consumers are spooked by a market in free-fall, it could settle much lower.

59 posted on 06/25/2002 4:48:14 PM PDT by Lazamataz
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To: Lazamataz
Ah, no they get de-listed.But you can always buy their bonds.
60 posted on 06/25/2002 4:48:15 PM PDT by habs4ever
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