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To: Snuffington
Agreed, but I feel obliged to point out to those who make blanket statements about secession being legal that they should qualify those statements. Secession is not legal just because they say it is, nor is it illegal because I say it is. However, when the Supreme Court issues the decision then it carries some weight.
77 posted on 06/25/2002 4:05:41 PM PDT by Non-Sequitur
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To: Non-Sequitur
However, when the Supreme Court issues the decision then it carries some weight.

And a special amount of weight when the SCOTUS Chief Justice was the same man as Secretary of Treasury that urged lincoln to start the war in the first place. Isn't that right, Non?

We both know the facts, whether you care to admit them or not. States north of the Confederacy had been threatening secession for decades. If the War of 1812 had not finished when it did, I sincerely believe that last paragraph of the Hartford Convention would have been carried out. Even the 'moderates' at the Convention while petitioning the government, and not listening to their more ardent members at the time, knew this would be a possibility, hence the arranging of the second meeting. Would it have happened then? Possibly but it was coming of that there can be no doubt. This of course is ignoring Massachusetts secession in 1803 among others. But ol' Sal answered the question once and for all in '69 didn't he?

78 posted on 06/25/2002 4:12:03 PM PDT by billbears
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To: Non-Sequitur
those who make blanket statements about secession being legal that they should qualify those statements

Consider the following from the Articles of Confederation (http://www.yale.edu/lawweb/avalon/artconf.htm)

the Articles of this Confederation shall be inviolably observed by every State, and the Union shall be perpetual; nor shall any alteration at any time hereafter be made in any of them; unless such alteration be agreed to in a Congress of the United States, and be afterwards confirmed by the legislatures of every State.

So how did the states legally secede from the Articles of Confederation and form a "more perfect union"? I submit that the secession of Texas and the other southern states from the authority of the US Constitution was just as legal as the secession of the original 13 states was from the Articles of Confederation.

You will probably contend that the main difference is that the southern states formed a new nation, whereas the original 13 states were simply changing the form of government for all 13. However, if you will read Article 7 of the US Constitution, you will see The ratification of the conventions of nine states, shall be sufficient for the establishment of this constitution between the states so ratifying the same.

The ninth state to ratify the Constitution was New Hampshire on June 21, 1788. Rhode Island and Vermont took another 2 and 2.5 years, respectively. Would Rhode Island and Vermont have had the legal right to invade and subjugate Delaware and Pennsylvania for unilaterally seceeding? After all, the Articles of Confederation specifically said the union was perpetual.

If each of the first 9 states to ratify the US Consitution had the legal right to do so, then all of the southern states similarly had the right to withdraw from one political agreement and enter into another one.

89 posted on 06/25/2002 10:17:11 PM PDT by robert0122
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