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I think he's underestimating Bush, which surprises me.

Of course he (Bush) knows a Palestinian state will be hostile, murderous and terror-generating. In my opinion, he (Bush) is setting up the perfect political trap for the Palestinians that will never allow one to happen. And he's done it from the very beginning.

If they don't stop the terror (which they won't)...fine. No state.

If they don't hold elections and dump Arafat (which they won't)...fine. No state.

If they don't accept israel's right to exist (which they won't)...fine. No state.

THERE WILL BE NO PALESTINIAN STATE...EVER. But, hey, our president gave them every opportunity to have one and they blew it. go get 'em, Ariel.

That's the way I heard the speech. As a huge hand of peace and goodwill from George Bush and the American people, to the peace-loving muslims of Palestine. See world? See Arab states we need for our war? We tried in good (cough) faith.

What more can we do.

Mark seems to think that there's no such thing as diplomacy and that Bush is selling out if he doesn't nuke gaza.

I think he's wrong. I still love him and think he's one of the most brilliant conservatives we have, but I think he's wrong.

Good points Deb...
Too many are jumping to conclusions and disregarding the true message laid out today.
America stands for Freedom and Democracy....conforming to these tenents achieves great reward and moral support.

Bush just read the Arab world the riot act...
The Arab world better snap to on this one..
No more complaining and sulking on the periphery of the economic world.
Change..or be numbered among those who oppose Freedom and Democracy"

Deb wrote: Mark seems to think that there's no such thing as diplomacy and that Bush is selling out if he doesn't nuke gaza.

It's a dictum with Rush that no war can be won unless the enemy is totally crushed, and I assume Levin believes likewise.

According to Rush Israel should roll over the Palestinians with a scorched-earth campaign a la Berlin in '45 until they plead for peace.

That this would probably engulf the whole Middle East in a war which might entail the use of nukes seems not to be a factor in the thinking of Rush & co.

I'm sorry I missed this discussion.

I would have been interested in asking Levin to lay out his plan for Middle East peace in detail.

From what I read of his posts he seemed to be as mad about Rush-bashing here as anything.

But where's the stick to go with this carrot?

By knowingly offering (in your view) an impossible plan, Bush is setting up the hopes of those who want a Palestinian state right now (like Clinton did in 2000) without stating the consequences of refusing this generous offer.

When it doesn't happen, and the blood runs in the streets in Israel and the occupied territories, then what ?

At least there was a few days without a successful terrorist attack on Israel so this initiative could be squeezed in. I wonder how many more will be murdered while we play this game?