[illstillbe]

Man .... I so hate this thread ... even as I see I dodged a bullet ... by waiting to reply ... for there is some wackiness here ... even as some speak without knowing what the heck they are talking about.

OK ... we are NOT losing our Country ... but we ARE at war and things have to change ... even as the left will try to eat the right and the right keeps trying to scrape off that third party glued to the bottom of its shoe ...

Meet Louis, please ... and his brother Alberto ....

I first met them both back in the early 90's .... I had thought to start a business of my own, you see ... and was at a wholesaler who had just brought in some ADD-a-Man workers .....illegal, all of them ... and all of us knew this ... though I was quakin' in my shoes ... at barely 5'1 to 2 ... if I stand up really straight ... and 100 pounds ... while Louis was topping out at 250 ... but this was back then ... even though it doesn't make it right ...

I wanted to plant pretty gardens, you see ... and needed some help ...

One contractor after another culled out the group ... never bothering to ask any questions ... never bothering to wonder what brought these men here .... ... and I felt like a criminal, which I was, of course ....

OK .... I moved up to Louis and introduced myself and told him I had a small gardening business ... and I needed some help. I watched to see if he understood what I had said .. and he nodded quickly, called me Flacka ... which stuck for the next 12 years ... and the very next words out of his mouth were, "Quiero ser un ciudadano de los Estados Desatados de America. Me pueda mostrar usted como hacer esto?"

There followed a journey which taught me more than I would have ever expected ... ... my little company finally totaled 18 immigrants ... only six illegal ... for Louis and I learned how to work the system ... and first naturalized new ones ... and then struggled through the red tape to make them all official. I never missed a chance to see them raise their hand ... and hold their heart up ... and Pledge Allegiance....

In November, of 2000 ... we all piled into my truck .... and, Mexican music blaring ...pulled up to the voting station ... and pulled the lever for G.W. Bush.

I am the Godmother to Louis' little girl .... and when circumstances dictated ... and I had to give this loved business over to Louis ... who researched ... and found loans ... and funded himself

.... He arrived at my house, of an early Spring day this year ... his crew ... which had been my crew ... planted my flowers in my pots for me ... and, in his quiet dignity, told me ... "Flacka ... you made me what I am ... I bring it back to you."

So. What are we to do with these earnest and heartfelt wanna-be citizens?!

There must be a way ... and I know I broke ALL the rules ... and wouldn't do it now, post September 11th ... still ... they are waiting ... so very much wanting to be a part of us ... and deservingly so ...

Thank you for indulging me ... or not ... depending on the comments to follow ....

[habs4ever]

:-)

[Neets]

Your words, as usual are quite touching..and I look to you as one speaking from experience, hence having more insight on the issues as those ill informed just spewing off for the sake of being heard.

I applaud you my dear.

[GraniteStateConservative]

Just don't accept a nomination for Secretary of Labor. This will haunt you then.

I think that setting up a program to allow illegals from Mexico to become somewhat legal (through some sort of documentation-- for work purposes for example) is probably the best route to go. Some don't ever want to be a part of America, but some do. I think Bush's plan is to try to deal with the problem through means other than complete deportation of all illegals. I agree with that.

[Clara Lou]

The world needs people like you. =-)

[dsutah]

That's a beautiful and inspiring story. Our family goes often to a Mexican restaurant nearby, and the owner is a very successfull, and law-abiding family man. So are his managers. One of them we became very friendly with. He employs a lot of fellow Hispanic workers. Many, if not most, eventually learn how to speak English, as they serve customers. His kids work there too, and they go to local schools and churches.

I believe he gives many of those in the immigrant community a chance to make it here, like he was given, if they want it badly, and work hard.

[bam]

While I believe that the experiences you relate are real and true and therefore must factor into the immigration dilemma and be a part of whatever conclusion and attitudes we arrive at as individuals and as a nation, those experiences are just that -- i.e. part of the whole equation rather than proof of overall final outcome. Just as I assume that someone who had a bad experience would be admonished for generalizing that experience into "all immigrants are bad", it is equally faulty logic to generalize a good experience into something like "anybody who objects to immigration is just spewing hatred and don't know what they are talking about". I'm not saying that you did or said this, but I have seen this in other poster's comments. You did say that "OK...we are NOT losing our Country", but from numerous and various sources (newspapers articles, posters here and elsewhere, talk radio, first hand face to face accounts), there is sufficient evidence, for me anyway, to have concern that we are losing at least large neighborhoods, communities, and effective schools due to the effects of illegal immigration -- if not the entire country or large parts thereof. I guess my point is that the experiences of those who relate the negatives of (illegal) immigration are, in general, as real and valid as those who express the positive and that the question that needs to be addressed is what are the current and long term effects and consequences of immigration, specifically illegal immigration as is being discussed here.

While I don't live in an area that so far has seen a great influx of illegal immigrants (but, I believe Joe when he says its coming to neighborhood near you), every few weeks I come across somebody who says they moved to the area to escape deteriorating neighborhood conditions in their hometown, usually due to illegal immigration, usually mentioning gang activity and usually, but not always, referring to them as Mexican gangs. The latest was from the Seattle area. If these folks are packing up all their belongings, leaving their long time homes, and moving half-way across the country to escape something, I can't believe that something isn't real. I've often wondered why we aren't expected to have compassion and concern for our own citizens being driven from their homes, but are presumably mean-spirited not to have compassion for those driving them out. And actually, I'm getting a little tired of seeing the grass and farmland paved over to make room for them (and I don't know where the water is supposed to come from), -- which is a secondary effect of illegal/legal immigration that is not often considered.

BTW, I do empathize with you and the individuals mentioned in your account, but obviously the problem is that such actions send the message that ignoring the law and jumping ahead of your place in line is okay and just invites more of it from the bad as well as the not so bad -- and maybe those lawfully waiting in line are equally or even more deserving and we just can't take everbody. As they say, the road ... is paved with good intentions.

[FITZ]

You describe a few illegals who came to work, and I know some myself who come to work, some don't even want to stay but wish to save their ranches and family in Mexico and return to the country they still love ---but you can take a drive through the projects here or the county hospitals and find plenty who are not here to work at all ---I know immigrants who never worked a day in their life in the US but are happy to exist on welfare. The other problem is the dropping wages in areas of extremely high immigration ---it's not easy for American families when less than 1 out of 3 wage earners is able to make more than $10 an hour because immigrants will work for $4 an hour without benefits.