Missile deal to boost Beijing's naval prowess

Taipei Times ^ | 6/18/02 | Brian Hsu

[mikhailovich]

Been watching too many movies, have you sir? Yes, I think. In case you haven't noticed, Putin ran against a communist and WON the popular VOTE. Putin is the most pro-democratic thing that happened to Russia maybe ever.

As for the terrorist insult, I won't reply, you're simply wrong. For that matter, I don't know of ANY terrorist attack against US interests Russia predicted. Do you?

[mikhailovich]

Suffice it to say the U.S. has sold arms to at least 4 nations that it is flying surveillance on, as we speak, planning for future attack.

Can you name one nation Russia has sold arms to and is planning to attack?

Checkmate. You make it too easy, lad.

[GOP_1900AD]

Nope. I never recall the CIA ever lowering a "mole" feet first into a crematory furnace and turning it into a "motivational" film for training new agents. I also do not recall the CIA ever forming an "inner CIA" that called the shots in running the nation. No, the KGB were / are far more similar to the SS than to the CIA...

[GOP_1900AD]

I refer to the bold prognostications of Dr. Tatiyana Korgyina, which, apparently, many a domestic Russian investor followed in the weeks leading up to 9/11. It is also quite curious just how quickly Mr. Putin was on the phone with Bush after the attacks. Almost as if scripted somehow.

[GOP_1900AD]

You have failed to answer the primary question... that of "when?". I submit that Russia continues to either provide, sell, codevelop or service the arms in a number of nations of the Trans-Asian Axis, whereas the US no longer do. I do not dispute that, at one point, during a past and glorious period of containment and roll back, the US were quite successful in setting up "the northern tier" including Syria, Iraq, Iran, Afghanistan and Pakistan. Gary Powers took off on his last flight from Afghanistan. Unfortunately, during the pacifist, naive liberal era from the early Kennedy adminsitration clear through to Reagan's first day in office, the US were losing ground, and each of the above nations fell into the orbits of either the USSR or the PRC (or both). During the Reagan years, the US (the CIA in particular) supplied Stingers and aid to seemingly "anti-Soviet" Islamist forces, but, due to our reliance on pro-PRC (and these days, increasingly neutral-to-pro Moscow) Pakistan, were duped into believing that the Paks were really on our side. Now we know...Musharraf's lies notwithstanding.

Long story short... the nations that we ought to blow away along the southern tier of the Trans-Asian Axis (.... then what, I might ask, constitutes the northern tier of said Axis?...) are now in either the Russian / neo-Soviet orbit, or the PRC one, or both, and, are, to their misfortune, only past but no longer current American allies. Too bad we could not hold on to them, too bad they will pay the price, and, most importantly, too bad Russia and / or the PRC are in bed with them. You are either with us, or ....

[AppyPappy]

Ram-jet, hmmm... I wonder what would happen if it went through a cloud of styrofoam peanuts.

[gcruse]

Ram-jet, hmmm... I wonder what would happen if it
went through a cloud of styrofoam peanuts.

How do you think they make Tide soap?

[mikhailovich]

You have a bonifide point with the question of "when." I'll give you that, but answer this question....tell me some suitable customers for Russian arms. For you see, in the "axis" picture as you so frequently deem it, customers tend to lump together in a naturally occurring division. Most of the caucasian nations of Europe and elsewhere buy from the US. Most Asian and Arab nations buy from Russia or China. Much of it has to do merely with geographics.

I don't believe the picture near so sinister as you paint it. At least not anymore.

Case in point, India flies Russian MiG fighters. Pakistan was sold a batch of F-16's (which fell through as you know). The F-16's were sold in part, as a courtship ritual. Economic and political consequences weighed heavily in that deal, as do most.

Look, arms are arms are arms. The US has made plenty of mistakes. So has Russia. The thing you (and many others) overlook is the economic variable. When the US sells 25 F-16's to Israel, local US communities are guaranteed employment contracts for perhaps years. These same cheerful news conferences happen in other countries too, not just the US.

Afghanistan is a quagmire. In Soviet times, the CIA gave anti-aircraft missiles to what would later become Al-Queda. The Soviet Union invaded Afghanistan. The local tribesmen kept tons of Russian arms left behind. Today, the tribesmen (Northern Alliance) parade Russian arms, side-by-side with their American soldier counterparts, against the very group that the Americans gave arms and training to - Al Queda.

Mister Belmont, it is the man behind the arms, won't you agree?