Between the two of you, we'll eventually be able to get Southern conservatives to abandon the treacherous party of Lincoln just as their fathers abandoned the treacherous democratic socialist party.
Keep posting your hateful lies, boy. You're doing us a world of good.
I have Dr. Steiner's phamphlet.
There is nothing to corroborate his observations.
The armed blacks he mentioned appear nowhere else in the record. Walt
It's no lie to quote Robert E. Lee and Jefferson Davis as having no apparent knowledge of black CSA soldiers, to say nothing of the so-called CSA congress.
Walt
Cite a lie that I have posted.
Your note is nothing but misinformation worthty of the Nazis or Soviet Union.
Call me 'boy' all you like. I am the man you are not.
Walt
KISSIMMEE, Fla. - The keynote speaker on Confederate Memorial Day drives a pickup truck with the Rebelaires blaringon the tape deck. He wears a slouch hat and a rebel-flag tie. His suit is gray. His skin is black. His words make many Civil War scholars see red.
"The history books were written by Yankees and they've seen fit to leave a lot out," Nelson Winbush tells 40 whites in a barn by the Kissimmee rodeo grounds. "Better than 90,000 blacks fought for the South."
As evidence, Mr, Winbush tells of his slave grandfather; Louis Napoleon Nelson, who went to war with his master's sons and went to his grave in 1934 wearing a rebel uniform. Mr, Winbush says scholars have covered up black loyalty to the South rather than upset Nortnern orthodoxy about the Civil War. "Yankees came way down here to free the slaves and found some black dude shooting their a- for keeps," he says.
When most Americans think of Civil War soldiers, the colors that spring to mind are blue and gray, not black. Until the 1989 movie "Glory," there was little recognition of the 200,000 blacks who fought for the North. Now, many Southerners say, it is time to honor another forgotten group: blacks who served the slave holding Confederacy. What makes this revisionism startling is that several of its leading proponents are blacks who regard their research as liberating.
"There's this caricature of all blacks in the South being victimized and supporting the North," says Edward Smith, a black professor and director of American Studies at American University in Washington. "But we are just as complicated as any people. We're three-dimensional. "
Since Mr. Smith began speaking about black Confederates six years ago, the subject has spawned several books, scores of articles and heated debate on the Internet. Some blacks have joined the Sons of Confederate Veterans and donned gray at Civil War re-enactments. Confederate heritage groups have proposed erecting monuments to black rebels and other "Confederates of color," such as Hispanics and American Indians.
Black Confederates have also become fodder in fights over the rebel battle flag, which flies over the South Carolina statehouse and forms part of Georgia's state banner. When New York Gov. George Pataki recently backed calls to boot Georgia's flag from Albany's display of state flags because of its "racist" component, he quickly roused ire. "As many as 50,000 brave young black men were wounded and killed fighting for the South," wrote Charlie Condon. South Carolina's attorney general in a letter. "Your slander of our region and its historic flag is outrageous and offensive.
But what many historians find outrageous and offensive are the claims being made by men like Mr. Condon Though he later revised his estimate to 50,000 blacks who "served in the Confederate Army," Mr. Smith at American University puts the number of black rebels "actually shooting people" at 30,000. Most historians regard this figure as inflated-by almost 30,000.
"It's pure fantasy," contends James McPherson, a Princeton historian and one of the nation's leading Civil War scholars. Adds Edwin Bearss, historian emeritus at the National Park Service: "It's b.s., wishful thinking." Robert Krick, author of 10 books on the Confederacy, has studied the records of 150,000 Southern soldiers and found fewer than a dozen were black. "Of course, if I documented 12. someone would start adding zeros," he says.
Tainted History?
These and other scholars say claims about black rebels derive from unreliable anecdotes, a blurring of soldiers and laborers, and the rapid spread on the Internet of what Mr. McPherson calls ''pseudohistory.'' Thousands of blacks did accompany rebel troops - as servants, cooks, teamsters and musicians. Most were slaves who served involuntarily; until the final days of the war, the Confederacy staunchly refused to enlist black soldiers.
Some blacks carried guns for their masters and wore spare or castoff uniforms, which may help explain eyewitness accounts of blacks units. But any blacks who actually fought did so unofficially, either out of personal loyalty or self-defense, many historians say.
They also bristle at what they see as the disingenuous twist on political correctness fueling the black Confederate fad. "it's a search for a multicultural Confederacy, a desperate desire to feel better about your ancestors," says Leslie Rowland, a University of Maryland historian. "if you suggest that some blacks supported the South, then you can deny that the Confederacy was about slavery and white supremacy."
David Blight, an Amherst College historian, likens the trend to bygone notions about happy "plantation darkies." Confederate groups invited devoted ex-slaves to reunions and even won Senate approval in 1923 for a "mammy" monument in Washington (it was never built). Black Confederates, Mr. Blight says, are a new and more palatable way to "legitimize the Confederacy."
These and other scholars say claims about black rebels derive from unreliable anecdotes, a blurring of soldiers and laborers, and the rapid spread on the Internet of what Mr. McPherson calls ''pseudohistory.'' Thousands of blacks did accompany rebel troops - as servants, cooks, teamsters and musicians. Most were slaves who served involuntarily; until the final days of the war, the Confederacy staunchly refused to enlist black soldiers.
Some blacks carried guns for their masters and wore spare or castoff uniforms, which may help explain eyewitness accounts of blacks units. But any blacks who actually fought did so unofficially, either out of personal loyalty or self-defense. many historians say.
They also bristle at what they see as the disingenuous twist on political correctness fueling the black Confederate fad. "it's a search for a multicultural Confederacy, a desperate desire to feel better about your ancestors," says Leslie Rowland, a University of Maryland historian. "if you suggest that some blacks supported the South, then you can deny that the Confederacy was about slavery and white supremacy."(AND GOD FORBID WE DO THAT!!!! WHY, lincoln WOULD BE OUTED AS THE TYRANT HE WAS)
David Blight, an Amherst College historian, likens the trend to bygone notions about happy "plantation darkies." Confederate groups invited devoted ex-slaves to reunions and even won Senate approval in 1923 for a "mammy" monument in Washington (it was never built). Black Confederates, Mr. Blight says, are a new and more palatable way to "legitimize the Confederacy."
War Against Stereotypes
But defenders of Confederate heritage say they are simply setting the record straight and battling another stereotype: that anyone who cherishes the Confederacy and its symbols is racist. During Black History Month, the Sons of Confederate Veterans posted a "fact sheet" on its Web page stating that thousands of blacks served the Confederacy "because it was their home. and they hoped for the reward of patriotism."
The SCV's lieutenant commander in chief, Patrick Griffin, says black service to the rebel cause reveals "a certain amount of solidarity" between slaves and masters. "Slavery was not a good thing, but it was part of the culture at the time: You had black and white people fighting to preserve their culture."
Groups like the SCV also make a point of citing blacks who have written on the subject, though that isn't always welcomed by the researchers themselves. "Some people use my material very selectively to promote their contemporary agenda," says Ervin Jordan. Jr., a black professor and archivist at the University of Virginia. For instance, the SCV and others often cite Mr. Jordan's estimate in a 1995 book that up to 15% of Virginia slaves supported the South. But they ignore the book's details of slavery's brutality, including an account of Robert E. Lee ordering his slaves whipped, and overlook Mr. Jordan's nuanced analysis of black rebels' motivation.
"These were people looking out for their own self-interest," he says. For instance, the South won many of the war's early battles and blacks plausibly saw it as shrewd to show support for the winning side.
But Mr. Jordan also resents the flak he has taken from liberal academics and fellow blacks who feel he is "airing dirty laundry" and abetting racists by writing about black loyalty to the South. He cites many historic examples of "people fighting in the forces of tbeir oppressors." such as Indians who scouted for the U.S. Army. "I don't think black Confederates should be pushed back in the closet because they're inconvenient or make us uncomfortable," he says.
Easy Fit
Rebel ancestry isn't uncomfortable at all for the black SCV member in Florida, Nelson Winbush. who fondly recalls his grandfather, Mr. Nelson, and his war tales. "He used to say the Yankees were the dumbest damned people you've ever seen," Mr. Winbush says, telling a story about Union men marcbing straight at rebel guns.
Mr. Winbush's trove of mementos includes pension papers and newspaper clippings describing his grandfather as a cook and servant in the Army, He also foraged for the rebels and, Mr, Winbush believes, "fired rifles like everyone else." though he has no proof. Nor does he-think it matters whether blacks filled combat or support roles. "Their lives were at risk: they served," he says.
His grandfather, Mr. Winbush goes on, grew up playing with white boys on the plantation and felt it was only natural to "go along with his pals" to fight Yankees. After the war, he attended 39 Confederate reunions and became a minor celebrity in his native Tennessee. "They all had a spot in their heart for the good old darky. and he loved them devotedly," a Tennessee paper wrote when Mr. Nelson died. Asked about the tone of such reports, Mr, Winbush shrugs. "Those were just the times." he says.
Complicated Times
Times have changed. Mr. Winbush, a retired teacher and assistant principal, once taught many of the men who now belong to his SCV group, which has been renamed in honor of his grandfather. Mr. Winbush's fellow members also welcome his Confederate Memorial Day address, which includes a defense of states' rights and of his grandfather's commander. Nathan Bedford Forrest. an oft-reviled figure who was a slave trader and imperial wizard of the Ku Klux Klan.
"We finally have someone who can give a different point of view and no one can say it's just another ignorant redneck trying to promote racism", says John Carroll, a founding member of the Kissimmee SCV camp.
Mr, Winbush has taken his message to groups across the South and appeared in a pro-Confederate video. He now plans to place a rebel veteran's headstone by his grandfather's grave. "I'm an individual, just like him." he says. driving to Kissimmee's cemetery to adorn rebel graves with battle flags. "People did what they thought was appropriate in that war, black and white, and I'm doing the same now."
He turns up his tape deck as the Rebelaires sing about the feelings of a black Confederate veteran: "You may not believe me, but things was just that way, Black is nothing other than a darker shade of rebel gray."
Mr. Winbush smiles. "That song tells it all," he says.
There you are Walt the whole article, the good and the bad. Of course I know you must have not seen the whole article, else you would have posted it. Goodness forbid you wouldn't try to slide something by like Ditto's 30 million slaves, now would you? So let's see. We've got a black man whose grandfather fought for the South(personal experience) and a yankee doctor among countless other anecdotes and you've got.... oh yeah, Mcpherson and a Park Ranger. That's even < /sarcasm> Something I found interesting from the article
"if you suggest that some blacks supported the South, then you can deny that the Confederacy was about slavery and white supremacy."
AND GOD FORBID WE DO THAT!!!!