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To: BlackElk
Ahem:

James 3:1 "3:1 This is a true saying, If a man desire the office of a bishop, he desireth a good work.
2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach;
3 Not given to wine, no striker, not greedy of filthy lucre; but patient, not a brawler, not covetous;
4 One that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity;
5 (For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?)
6 Not a novice, lest being lifted up with pride he fall into the condemnation of the devil.
7 Moreover he must have a good report of them which are without; lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.
8 Likewise must the deacons be grave, not doubletongued, not given to much wine, not greedy of filthy lucre;
9 Holding the mystery of the faith in a pure conscience.
10 And let these also first be proved; then let them use the office of a deacon, being found blameless.
11 Even so must their wives be grave, not slanderers, sober, faithful in all things.
12 Let the deacons be the husbands of one wife, ruling their children and their own houses well.
13 For they that have used the office of a deacon well purchase to themselves a good degree, and great boldness in the faith which is in Christ Jesus.
14 These things write I unto thee, hoping to come unto thee shortly:
15 But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.
16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.
4:1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;
2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;
3 Forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth.

=o)

161 posted on 07/02/2002 9:33:44 PM PDT by MissAmericanPie
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To: MissAmericanPie
I thought your "work" on this thread was at an end.

Posting each and every word of Scripture will not make you right. Luther reviled the Epistle of James as unfit for Christians to read presumably because he perceived danger to his curious teachings from James's assertion that faith without works is dead. He also reviled the Apocalypse. He also actually removed several Old Testament books which, surprise, surprise, differed from other curious notions of his. Compared to his successors, of course, Luther is a pillar of orthodoxy, however impudent, and, according to the old American Lutheran Church's film biography of Luther (played by Stacy Keach), he spent his final days, months and years denouncing those Protestants who had the nerve, the nerve, to assert disagreement with the great Reformer and, of course, sucking up to the secular and insubordinate princes and other sources of wealth whose rebellions of a political sort were augmented by his rebellions (protests?) against the Church of Jesus Christ.

There is no possible way of maintaining a rational discussion with someone who is speaking an entirely different language. You do not know what a priest is or a bishop or a deacon or the Holy Eucharist or the sacraments and if you are told you persist in any event in your fantasies. You think that your ability to read and possession of someone's translation of Scripture makes you a qualified arbiter of theology. You are not. In all likelihood, you cannot or do not distinguish between venial and mortal sin.

Noting as I do that your excuse for sticking your uninvited nose into the governance of the Roman Catholic Church to which you do not belong was that we have somehow brought you into disrepute as a Christian or brought Jesus Christ into disrepute because a limited number of our clergy are sinners (we are neither surprised nor amused and much better situated than you to do something about it which we will without your nosy intrusions) by way of lavender perversion with children (and I would add with male teenagers, or adult men), you simply MUST intervene and give to Catholics the dubious benefit of your utterly uninvited and priggish self-righteousness (and opportunistic and bigoted attacks on the Roman Catholic Church in the forlorn silly hope that we will regard you as an authority which it is patently obvious that you are not). Nonetheless, after you promised that your "work" whatever that was had come to an end here, you are now posting from the Epistle of James, not as to the controversy but as some sort of support for your dogmatic disagreements with the Church of Rome.

I am not going to further waste time on you on these subjects. Bray in the wilderness. Build up your Tower of Babel and of babble. Fantasize unto the very end. Finally, mind your own business. Run your own church as you see fit to the extent you are allowed. If you are so offended by Catholicism, do not join with us in defense of moral values in our nation and our world. Watch out lest you be contaminated. So what if they kill 4500 babies per day? Take those who totally agree with you, all four of them and confront the powers that be in society. No one will notice, but who cares, after all your unjustified self-esteem is at stake. So are your fantasies.

Bye-bye, etc.

164 posted on 07/03/2002 5:20:24 PM PDT by BlackElk
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