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Marines May Add Special Ops Force
USA Today | June 5, 2002 | Dave Moniz

Posted on 06/05/2002 7:37:51 AM PDT by LavaDog

WASHINGTON — The Marine Corps, which has resisted creating a permanent unit of commandos throughout its 227-year history, has been spurred by the war on terrorism to move in that direction this fall.

The Marines will assign several dozen troops to a Tampa headquarters that oversees all U.S. commandos. That could prompt it to establish a special operations force, Marine officials say.

The move highlights how the war on terrorism has elevated the importance of commando units. Army Green Berets, Navy SEALs and Air Force rescue teams have played key roles in the hunt for al-Qaeda terrorists in Afghanistan.

The U.S. Special Operations Command will help integrate the Marines with the 46,000 Army, Navy and Air Force commandos it now oversees.

Although no final decision has been made on creating a separate commando unit, Marine Corps officials say the reassignments increase the odds that it will happen.

David Segal, a military sociologist at the University of Maryland, says the Afghanistan experience makes it clear "that our special operations capabilities have to grow."

"If you don't get into the game, the extra numbers of people will go to the other services," he says.

The Marine Corps had a small number of "raider" commandos during World War II, but it has opposed a permanent force because it believes every Marine is an elite fighter. A Marine creed is "Every Marine a rifleman."

Even so, the Marines have about 800 troops who are not considered commandos but receive special training in reconnaissance techniques similar to those used by Army Special Forces soldiers.

Lt. Col. Giles Kyser, a Marine officer familiar with the decision to assign Marine forces to Tampa headquarters, says the move will create a delicate balancing act. "We need to change our training and procedures," Kyser says, "while at the same time holding onto things that make us Marines."


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To: AAABEST
Side note, that bastard doesn't even have a CIB. What was he doing during all of our wars, passing out wool socks?

He was a cannon-cocker, hurting people's ears on both ends. They don't generally pick up CIBs along the way, though some who go out and act as forward observers with Infantry units do, and some Artillery officers branch transfer or are detailed to Special Forces, where that's a bit more common.

-archy-/-

21 posted on 06/05/2002 9:47:24 AM PDT by archy
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To: disgustedvet
Seriously though. If I am not mistaken, Shinseki's background is machanized. During the beret fight last year, I read reports that he wore a black beret in 'Nam, unauthorized of course, just like the Brit's armored troops do. I guess that is why he wanted the black beret ..... so he could make our Army look cool just like the Brits.
Genious.

It appears he earned his black beret as an English teacher at West Point...Per his bio:

Since his commissioning, Shinseki has served in a variety of command and staff assignments both in the Continental U.S. and overseas, to include two combat tours with the 9th and 25th Infantry Divisions in the Republic of Vietnam as an artillery forward observer and as commander of Troop A, 3rd Squadron, 5th Cavalry. He has served in Hawaii at Schofield Barracks with Headquarters, United States Army Hawaii, and Fort Shafter with Headquarters, United States Army Pacific.

Shinseki has taught at the United States Military Academy’s Department of English. During duty with the 3rd Armored Cavalry Regiment at Fort Bliss, Texas, he served as the regimental adjutant and as the executive officer of its 1st Squadron. His ten-plus years of service in Europe included assignments as commander, 3rd Squadron, 7th Cavalry (Schweinfurt); commander, 2nd Brigade, (Kitzingen); assistant chief of staff G3 (Operations, Plans and Training) (Wuerzburg); and assistant division commander, maneuver (Schweinfurt), all with the 3rd Infantry Division (Mechanized).

Shinseki served as the assistant chief of staff, G3 (Operations, Plans and Training), VII Corps (Stuttgart). He served as the deputy chief of staff for support, Allied Land Forces Southern Europe (Verona, Italy), an element of the Allied Command Europe. From March 1994 to July 1995, he commanded the 1st Cavalry Division at Fort Hood, Texas. In July 1996, he was promoted to lieutenant general and became the deputy chief of staff for operations and plans, U.S. Army. In June 1997, Shinseki was appointed to the rank of general before assuming duties as the commanding ceneral, U.S. Army Europe; commander, Allied Land Forces Central Europe; and commander, NATO Stabilization Force in Bosnia-Herzegovina. Gen. Shinseki assumed duties as the 28th Vice Chief of Staff, U.S. Army on Nov. 24, 1998.

General Shinseki has been awarded the Defense Distinguished Service Medal, Distinguished Service Medal, Legion of Merit (with Oak Leaf Clusters), Bronze Star Medal with “V” Device (with 2 Oak Leaf Clusters), Purple Heart (with Oak Leaf Cluster), Meritorious Service Medal (with 2 Oak Leaf Clusters), Air Medal, Army Commendation Medal (with Oak Leaf Cluster), Army Achievement Medal, Parachutist Badge, Ranger Tab, Office of the Secretary of Defense Identification Badge, Joint Chiefs of Staff Identification Badge, and the Army Staff Identification Badge.

22 posted on 06/05/2002 9:52:36 AM PDT by archy
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To: disgustedvet
Seriously though. If I am not mistaken, Shinseki's background is machanized. During the beret fight last year, I read reports that he wore a black beret in 'Nam, unauthorized of course, just like the Brit's armored troops do. I guess that is why he wanted the black beret ..... so he could make our Army look cool just like the Brits. Genious.

Not all black berets in Vietnam were unauthorized, as black ones were specified for 69th Armor's tankers per Department of the Army orders. It was the Rangers who were not authorized black berets until after Vietnam, chosen the first commanding officer of the Ranger battalion at Ft Lewis, Washington, Colonel Bo Baker, later killed in a parachute *accident* making the colour choice all the more appropriate.


23 posted on 06/05/2002 10:04:56 AM PDT by archy
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To: stylin19a
Also, if Spec Ops are so elite, how come there are 46,000 of them and growing every day

My son has a friend who's father trains Green Berets. He's p-o'd at Green Beret recruitment. Previously, an experienced soldier had to be recommended for the Green Berets. But now, because recruitment is so low, the Army is letting new recruits directly into the Green Berets.

24 posted on 06/05/2002 10:10:45 AM PDT by DallasDeb
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To: disgustedvet
GEN Shinseki's background is as an Armor officer, hence, the lack of CIB. My reliable sources who served with him in earlier years state that he relished wearing the black beret as an Armor Battalion Commander in Germany. The Army had a problem with beret madness in the late 70's - early 80's. The CSA at that time (Bernie Rogers, as I recall) put a stop to it, allowing only airborne, special forces and ranger units to wear appropriately colored berets. The official hype broadcasted 18 months ago by Shinseki was a smokescreen to get the beret back on his head, IMO.
25 posted on 06/05/2002 10:16:07 AM PDT by TADSLOS
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Comment #26 Removed by Moderator

To: LavaDog
"Maybe we can wear raspberry berets too!"

I feel that I would be remiss in my duties if did not post the theme song of the Navy's Silent Service.


The Ballad of the Navy Blue Beret
(With accompanying midi file---CLICK HERE)


27 posted on 06/05/2002 10:39:05 AM PDT by Scuttlebutt
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To: AAABEST
You've got this thing for army wool socks. Somehow your posts get around to them. I had an EX-POW SERE instructor who told me when he was a captive he spanked off so much in an army wool sock he started to grow a toe nail on the end of his.... you get the the idea.
28 posted on 06/06/2002 12:10:02 PM PDT by MP5SD
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To: MP5SD
LMFAO!!

Dude you just cracked me the hell up. I needed it to.

29 posted on 06/06/2002 4:07:59 PM PDT by AAABEST
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To: MP5SD
LMFAO!!

Dude you just cracked me the hell up. I needed it to.

30 posted on 06/06/2002 4:08:00 PM PDT by AAABEST
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