Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

To: lentulusgracchus
Inthe first place the amendment was done under Buchanan, and was debated and passed a month and a half after 7 states had seceded. Lincoln had nothing to do with it. In fact, since constitutional amendments require a 2/3rds vote for passage, a presidential signature is not even called for.

I'm not sure what Lincoln could have said that would have prevented the rebellion. He said repeatedly that it was not in his power to end slavery and that was not his intention. But he did say expess over and again his personal belief in the evil of slavery, and he did say that he expected that the house would cease to be divided at some point. Maybe that was enough for the secessionist firebrands.

318 posted on 05/25/2002 4:06:21 AM PDT by Non-Sequitur
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 298 | View Replies ]


To: Non-Sequitur
In the first place the [1861 proposed Thirteenth] amendment was done under Buchanan, and was debated and passed a month and a half after 7 states had seceded. Lincoln had nothing to do with it. In fact, since constitutional amendments require a 2/3rds vote for passage, a presidential signature is not even called for. [Emphasis added.]

Thanks for the additional points in clarification, and for emphasizing that Lincoln did nothing to arrest the drift toward disunion and war. It is my working thesis that he wanted both, in order to accomplish his political hat trick that would end slavery in the South, which I repeat was, in my humble opinion, his genuine, working, and confidential programme of political change.

I'm not sure what Lincoln could have said that would have prevented the rebellion.

I am astonished at your ingenuousness. (And oh, by the way, if by "rebellion" you mean secession, then we are discussing the same events.) Lincoln, I assure you, could have said plenty -- but then, that wasn't his platform, and it wasn't his intended work, was it?

He said repeatedly that it was not in his power to end slavery and that was not his intention.

Funny how he got the power, and accomplished what he kept saying in 1860, with the children in the room, what was not his intention. Come on, N-S, think about it. Or do you believe everything a politician says while he's still sharpening his skinning knife?

But he did say expess over and again his personal belief in the evil of slavery, and he did say that he expected that the house would cease to be divided at some point. Maybe that was enough for the secessionist firebrands.

Subsequent events proved that they were both firebrands, and sensible men who knew exactly what Lincoln intended.

345 posted on 05/25/2002 1:29:14 PM PDT by lentulusgracchus
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 318 | View Replies ]

To: Non-Sequitur
Inthe first place the amendment was done under Buchanan, and was debated and passed a month and a half after 7 states had seceded. Lincoln had nothing to do with it.

You are incorrect.

Buchanan eventually lent his support to that amendment, but it was first and foremost a Lincoln project. William Seward first proposed it before the Committee of Thirteen in December, 1860 after recieving direct instructions from Lincoln to do so. From there on Lincoln carefully managed, and at first in great secrecy, its path through Congress up until the days before it was voted on by the full house and senate. Newspaper accounts at the time document extensively that Lincoln publicly lobbied for it during those final days. Henry Adams credits the amendment's success in Congress entirely to Lincoln, noting it passed due to the "direct influence of the new President." Lincoln followed a few days later by openly endorsing it in his inaugural address.

361 posted on 05/25/2002 2:20:17 PM PDT by GOPcapitalist
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 318 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson