[JMJ333]

Post 66 qualifies as a rage. And I am not hysterical, merely tired of having to repeat myself. It is hard for me to believe that you need me to define "value."

Also, the time frame is in the article and also posted in italics in post 57. I could trace the devaluization of life beginning as a long-tern outgrowth of the protestant revolut, but that would be getting really off track. The article is dealing with the results of how contraception has lead to a loss of dignity for humanity--meaning that when "free sex" became the focus instead of family--it lead to abortion and other things that lead to a devaluing of our intrinsic worth from conception until natural death. The outgrowth of these being things I have already outlined for you.

[Lorianne]

Post 66 qualifies as a rage. It is hard for me to believe that you need me to define "value."

"Value" is very subjective. Post 66 was an attempt to get you to list what would be examples of manifestations of "devalueing human life". Is that a code phrase for abortion? If so I agree. But are there other manifestations of "devalueing human life" which we can discuss?

The article is dealing with the results of how contraception has lead to a loss of dignity for humanity--meaning that when "free sex" became the focus instead of family--it lead to abortion and other things that lead to a devaluing of our intrinsic worth from conception until natural death.

Ok abortion is one. What are the "other things"?

Other cultures which don't embrace contraceptives and which have a stronger focus on "family" than ours DO allow other types of "devaluation of human life" by my standards. Such as abortion, sex selective abortion, infanticide, sex selected infaticide, child abandonment, withholding of nutrition from children (especially female children), restriction of access to food and health care for women and children, forced child prostititution, slavery, etc, etc.

All this has existed for eons before contraceptives (except sex selected abortion) in many cultures, and continues to exist in cultures which do not embrace contraceptives and which have a strong focus on family.

So, we agree abortion is devalueing human life. What would be devalueing human life? Is abortion the only "devaluation of human life" we are talking about here? What else? And can all "devaluation of human life" be linked to contraceptive acceptance?

I guess I don't understand why we're limiting this conversation to a narrow time frame directly before the introduction of contraceptives and after, or why we have to limit it to only one culture.

If we one wants to create a link between contraceptives and "devaluation of human life" (a very broad phrase unless is it code for one thing) then it seems one has to compare contraception accepting cultures with non-contraceptive accepting cultures .... and we'd have to define exactly what constitutes "devalueing human life". What is included in that phrase, what is excluded?

[Lorianne]

Also, the time frame is in the article and also posted in italics in post 57.

Post #57 only mentions one date Aug 15, 1930. What is the time frame of for comparison of how human life was valued BEFORE contraception was widely accepted vs. how human life is valued AFTER contraception was widely accepted.

How far back before Aug 15, 1930 are we extending the time frame for the purpose of this comparison? And while we're at it, what cultures are you limiting the discussion to for the purpose of such a comparison?