[Ronaldus Magnus]

So your use of the word "value" has no value itself unless or until you qualify it with objective standards. Which "value of human life" exactly are/were you talking about vis a vis cultures which didn't/don't embrace contraceptives?

Objective standards or not, you err in attempting to use a cross-cultural argument to disprove a time-based effect assertion. The statement that "contraception is immoral and has lead directly to the devaluing of life" needs to be examined in a before and after framework to test its veracity. Your litany of tourist horror stories does nothing to undermine the original assertion since we have no idea what they were like before a contraception mentality was introduced (or what effect such an introduction would have).

[Lorianne]

Objective standards or not, you err in attempting to use a cross-cultural argument to disprove a time-based effect assertion.

How can we evaluate the statement without a control group who don't embrace contraceptives?

The statement that "contraception is immoral and has lead directly to the devaluing of life" needs to be examined in a before and after framework to test its veracity.

Right. Which is what I attempted to do. I also you contemporaneous examples but we can go back as far in history as you want and find the same "valuation" dissonance. However, there are impracticalities in comparing modern Western standards of "valueing human life" to previous time periods. Which is why I asked the author of the comment to outline what he means by the word "value" so that we know what we are comparing with what.

Your litany of tourist horror stories does nothing to undermine the original assertion since we have no idea what they were like before a contraception mentality was introduced (or what effect such an introduction would have).

These are not "tourist horror stories". I lived and worked in many of these places. These are real human lives and real human suffering. Are you perhaps devalueing humans of other cultures than our own?

The fact is that contraception is not part of their culture and yet .... individual lives are NOT valued in the same way they are in our culture which does embrace contraceptives. What are we to do with this dissonance between the premis presented and the facts?