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To: general_re
The "order of things" is just the way things are, but we have a sense that it is "orderly" or "neat" or "tidy", and these are all subjective judgements.

It's not so simple - or perhaps I should say it is simple and that's the complication. You seem to have a mathematical bent so I'm sure you're aware that there are are vastly more ways for things to be complicated than simple. It could conceivably have been one massive entangled quantum system with everything connected to everything else. Or spacetime could have been riddled with multiple connectedness. Instead the stuff in the universe seems well separated, spacetime is singly connected (at least locally) and by and large the rules and patterns are simple. I'd say this simplicity is an objective feature of the universe and also a curious one. It'd sure be nice to have a satisfying explanation.

651 posted on 05/12/2002 11:03:20 PM PDT by edsheppa
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To: edsheppa
It's not so simple - or perhaps I should say it is simple and that's the complication. You seem to have a mathematical bent so I'm sure you're aware that there are are vastly more ways for things to be complicated than simple.

Perhaps. If I accept such a thing, would you say that the current simplicity is the only way for things to be simple?

It could conceivably have been one massive entangled quantum system with everything connected to everything else. Or spacetime could have been riddled with multiple connectedness. Instead the stuff in the universe seems well separated, spacetime is singly connected (at least locally) and by and large the rules and patterns are simple.

Suppose we lived in a universe that was as "complicated" as you suggest. Presumably we would have brains that evolved in an environment, and therefore, in order to develop some sort of rational thinking ability, we would need the ability to make sense of what we saw around us - to detect patterns and to categorize things, to think abstractly, and so forth. If we lived in such a universe, do you think we would describe it as "simple", or "complicated"?

IOW, if a creature with the ability to reason were to evolve in such a universe, wouldn't the ability to reason imply an ability to make sense of the things around them - or at least be a necessary precondition to reason? And if you can make sense of it, is it really "complicated"? ;)

652 posted on 05/13/2002 5:58:27 AM PDT by general_re
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