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To: TopQuark
Please, I fear you misundertand me. I'm not saying I agree with the conduct of the British. I don't, and my forebears some 350 years ago didn't, and other forebears fought two wars against England because they didn't, which is why 'in spite of all the temptations, to belong to other Nations, I am an American' not an Englishman, to twist Gilbert & Sullivan's paen to Englishness.

I find it natural in the English because I know them and how they think. Classical liberal (Whig) England gave us the notion of equality before the law, even if there remained social disabilities, and that's more or less what is still true in England: there is no discrimination against Jews in getting places at Oxford or Cambridge or in finance in the City, what discrimination exists is social.

What I said, and I maintain, is that it surprises me that any bright person raised in England would not understand that howevermuch the ethnic 'English' may be perfectly happy to admit others to the privileges of citizenship, and even the peerage, it doesn't mean they have to like them or socizlize with them. Young Mr. Pollard has been unobservant if he didn't realize this. Is it OK? No. Is it a fact? Yes.

I appreciate many things about the English, including their steadfastness generally and as our allies in particular. But, they are and always have been quite ethnocentric.

42 posted on 04/30/2002 5:30:36 PM PDT by CatoRenasci
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To: CatoRenasci
Many thanks for your informative reply; I have indeed misconstrued your previous post.

I appreciate also your insight into the ethnocentrism of the English. Many behaviors that stem from it are empirically indistinguishable from the obsession with class, so some of the things to which you refer I have attributed to the latter. Perhaps, I have indeed underestimated the ethnocentrism of the English.

Like you, I am grateful to the English for preserving for us the idea of representation in government that they themselves brought from the continent as part of the Teutonic tradition. I'm also grateful for the overall enlightenment of that society in comparison with the continental Europe --- the enlightenment, which we imported in the beginning of our own history. I do not miss, of course, their preoccupation with class and ethnocentrism.

Thank you again for your nice and informative note.

57 posted on 05/01/2002 4:17:37 AM PDT by TopQuark
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