B.S.
You all can't bear to hear the truth about Lincoln because it proves the Yankee's culpability for an unjust war of aggression.
Posted on 04/29/2002 10:04:22 PM PDT by davidjquackenbush
What an ironic tragedy the war was. Industrialist versus Agrarian, Hamilton's urban mercantilist legacy versus Jefferson's gentlemen farmers, free-traders versus protectionists, statist's versus confederates, all destined to kill each other by the hundreds of thousands because of the economic, political, and cultural divisions created by an antiquated, immoral idea of property rights?
What a shame the Southern reform experiment was snuffed out in it's crib. The two systems would have evolved, shared, competed, and prospered from the march of the technological revolution with far more benefit to future world history, but for a farsighted, super-intelligent, ambitious corporate lawyer, who remolded the working thesis of continental government and of warfare.
Many thanks, again.
"Within twenty years we can peacefully colonize the negro and give him our language, literature, religion, and system of government under conditions in which he can rise to the full measure of manhood. This he can never do here. We can never attain the ideal union our fathers dreamed of, with millions of an alien, inferior race among us, whose assimilation is neither possible nor desirable."
-- A. Lincoln, in an address given in Washington D.C. (found in in Basler, Collected Works, Volume V, pages 371-375)
177 posted on 4/30/02 7:42 PM Pacific by ConfederateMissouri
********
Let me tell you again, this quote is bogus.
Here is what 4ConservativeJustices says about it on another thread.
*********
To: rdf
[snip]
Regarding the other quotes attributed to Lincoln on 14 Aug 1862 (and cited in Collected Works of Abraham Lincoln (by Basler, ed., Vol. V, pp. 371-375), I can assure you that they are not on those pages - and nowhere in the entire collection can I find those remarks. That being the case, I apologize for relying on misinformation and attributing those remarks incorrectly to Lincoln, and withdraw them from consideration.
What is contained on page 370-375 is the "Address on Colonization to a Deputation of Negroes " posted previously.
[snip] FReegards,
4CJ
291 posted on 4/26/02 9:53 AM Pacific by 4ConservativeJustices [ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 288 | View Replies | Report Abuse ]
*********
Really, you do harm to yourself and to your cause by using it. As 4CJ pointed out to me, this "quote" is from the novel, "The Clansman." I can give you the link, and I can also link you to Basler, where you can see for yourself that Lincoln did not say these words on pp 371-375. There is a fine search engine there, and you can also see that Lincoln nowhere said it.
I hope you will have the decency to follow the example of 4CJ, and both apologize and never use this fraud again.
Regards,
Richard F.
I hope my reply meets with your approval.
Regards,
Richard F.
Richard F.
This is one of the few points on which I agree with DiLorenzo. Based on my quick word search of the debates, it appears that Lincoln did very briefly mention his belief that a national bank was Constitutional on several occasions, so McPherson overstated the single-issue nature of the debates somewhat. Of course, Lincoln's comments about the Constitutionality of a national bank severely undercuts DiLorenzo's attempt to paint Lincoln as anti-Constitutional.
Also, let us not forget that slavery was certainly an economic as well as a moral issue, what with the Confederates putting a value on their cherished institution of at least $3 billion at a time when the annual federal budget was only $63 million.
Thanks for all your efforts in pointing out DiLorenzo's atrocious scholarly deficiencies.
BTW, what was wrong with your "Who is George Salt" screen name? Too many posts linking to communist websites under that nick?
You seem to be implying that Carl Sandburg is not a valid Lincoln historian because he was a (democratic) socialist who presumably admired Lincoln, believing him to be a fellow socialist. If that is the case, it should be a simple matter for you to find Sandburg quotes which admiringly suggest that Lincoln was a socialist. Where are they?
I wonder how rdf and davidquackenbush can pass themselves off as academics when neither has ever published anything and neither is employed in academia. Accusing a professor of fraud while pretending to be his among his peers is fraud in and of itself. Of course, they are free to lie and slander here. They will never do much offline where the actual work of academia takes place.
If you go back and read what Tocqueville wrote in the 1830's, you will see that he predicted that (a) the U.S. Constitution would lead to a concentration of power, and (b) slavery was the thing which would be most likely to cause an American civil war. Blaming tariffs for big government is like blaming a cheeseburger for a heart attack.
Never happen, for the simple reason that 4ConservativeJustices is a class act, while ConfederateMissouri is just an act.
How long were you willing to let Southerners "experiment" with slavery? Would you be willing to volunteer for an "experiment" where you're the one wearing leg irons and having a horse whip cracked across your back?
B.S.
You all can't bear to hear the truth about Lincoln because it proves the Yankee's culpability for an unjust war of aggression.
"As Lincoln biographer David Donald has written, 'Under the protection of Federal bayonets, New York went Republican by seven thousand votes'... in the 1864 election". The source for the Donald quote is: "Lincoln Reconsidered" Vintage Books, 1961, p. 81.
That is still a secondary source, but it better than nothing. It remains to be seen if it will stand up to the type of scrutiny that is putting Dilorenzo's credibility in the toilet.
Okay, as I thought, Donald changed his tune quite a bit with his more recent bio of Lincoln:
"But there were limits to what Lincoln would do to secure a second term. He did not even consider canceling or postponing the election. Even had that been constitutionally possible, "the election was a necessity." "We can not have free government without elections," he explained; "and if the rebellion could force us to forego, or postpone a national election, it might fairly claim to have already conquered and ruined us." He did not postpone the September draft call, even though Republican politicians from all across the North entreated him to do so. Because Indiana failed to permit its soldiers to vote in the field, he was entirely willing to furlough Sherman's regiments so that they could go home and vote in the October state elections —but he made a point of telling Sherman, "They need not remain for the Presidential election, but may return to you at once."
Though it was clear that the election was going to be a very close one, Lincoln did not try to increase the Republican electoral vote by rushing the admission of new states like Colorado and Nebraska, both of which would surely have voted for his reelection. On October 31, in accordance with an act of Congress, he did proclaim Nevada a state, but he showed little interest in the legislation admitting the new state. Despite the suspicion of both Democrats and Radicals, he made no effort to force the readmission of Louisiana, Tennessee, and other Southern states, partially reconstructed but still under military control, so that they could cast their electoral votes for him. He reminded a delegation from Tennessee that it was the Congress, not the Chief Executive, that had the power to decide whether a state's electoral votes were to be counted and announced firmly, “Except it be to give protection against violence, I decline to interfere in any way with the presidential election.”
"Lincoln", pp. 539-40 by David H. Donald
"Lincoln encouraged soldier voting in the field so enthusiastically that E. B. Washbume said, "If it could be done in no other way, the president would take a carpet bag and go around and collect those votes himself." He even went so far as to permit Republican agents to use a government steamer on the Mississippi River to collect the ballots of sailors on the federal gunboats. On election day hun-dreds of federal employees in Washington were furloughed in order to return to their homes and vote. "Even the camps and hospitals are de- pleted," reported the banker Henry D. Cooke; "the streets wear a quiet Sunday air—in the Department buildings, the empty corridors respond with hollow echoes to the foot fall of the solitary visitor; the hotels are almost tenantless, and the street cars drone lazily along the half-filled seats." The election went off smoothly. From the earliest returns it was clear that the Republicans had won a huge victory they carried every state except New Jersey, Delaware, and Kentucky. The Democrats had waged a vigorous campaign with a united party, and Democratic candidates made a strong showing in the cities and in those counties where there were large numbers of Irish-American and German-American voters. The 45 percent of the popu- lar vote that McClellan received was more than respectable, especially in view of the fact that all the Southern states were still out of the Union and, of course, not voting. Republican success was due largely to the same groups of voters who had supported the party in 1860—native-born farmers in the countryside, better-off skilled workers and professional men in the city, and voters of New England descent everywhere. As in 1860, younger voters were especially attracted to the Republican party, and the soldier vote went overwhelmingly for Lincoln. Election night was rainy and foggy in Washington, and the President spent the evening at the War Department waiting for the returns. The first reports were encouraging, and he sent them over to Mrs. Lincoln, saying, "She is more anxious than I."
Presently Thomas T. Eckert, head of the telegraph office, came in, wet and muddy because he had fallen while crossing the street. In a genial mood, the President was reminded of another rainy evening back in 1858 when he had been on the square at Springfield reading the returns on his contest with Douglas for the Senate. On his way home he nearly fell in the muddy street, but he recovered himself and thought, "It's a slip and not a fall."
"for such an awkward fellow," he remarked to the group in the telegraph office, I am pretty sure footed."
Ibid, p. 544
Donald mentions no form of coercion at all in regards to Lincoln's conduct of either the 1862 or 1864 elections.
Walt
Walt
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.