St. Pat Msgr. Hits Gays On Scandal / Blames woes on 'disorder,' U.S. immorality

New York Daily News ^ | 4/22/02 | NICOLE BODE and GREG GITTRICH

[Argus]

The only time I've seen people walk out of Mass was during a rare sermon regarding the disorder of homosexuality.

I walked out of a packed house the Sunday after 9/11 when the homilist started off referring to the sneak attack as a "tragedy" and wondering why such bad things happen, and similar mealy-mouthed BS. I couldn't sit there and listen to it. Later, I wrote a letter to the pastor about it, and his sermon the following Sunday was a patriotic course-correction. If we get off our asses and protest, vocally, they will respond.

[Clint N. Suhks]

Why do you say.. "you" as if I have this crusade to committ these horrible acts myself..

First of all I didn’t say “you” but we can pretend I did if you want. Second, you’re the one justifying how “it’s up to the people how they want to live,” so why don’t you support the same for incestuals and bestials, they’re morally and ethically the same as homosexuals?

I care not to even dignify you with an answer...

Yep, tough question unless you want to be a hypocrite.

[INSENSITIVE GUY]

Hard to argue with the truth unless--YOUR A LIAR!

[eastsider]

To avoid these and try to throw all the focus on celibacy seems a tad obscurantist and dishonest, if not ideologically biased.

Please don't misunderstand my position. I think there's much to be said for there being an ensconced cadre of liberal perverts whose mischief has contributed to the present sorry state of affairs, and I am under no delusion that a further relaxation of celibacy is a panacea or isn't fraught with its own problems -- although nothing immediately comes to mind quite as insidious as sexually preying on our youth. I'm merely suggesting that the Church should consider the relaxation of mandatory celibacy for the diocesan priesthood as part of a multi-pronged campaign to set things straight (so to speak : )

[Almondjoy]

Your right I just put in "you" to be simple.. you assumed in your question that I had no problem with it.. as if I personally thought it was ok to justify those actions... in other news... hey.. more power to the sheep herders if you know what I'm saying.

[eastsider]

What I feel is life is when the fetus inside the womb is able to function outside of the body.

What does functioning outside the womb have to do with whether the fetus is alive? If it's not alive, it's inanimate. Are you arguing that the fetus is inanimate, even though it is developing, taking in nutrients and voiding waste products?

[Almondjoy]

I better reply to incest before I get eaten up for that one... Are they of age? Meaning over 18? Bah let them go to hell if they want far as I'm concerned... no need to waste my tax dollars seeking out Cornfed brother and sister in the boonies.

[Almondjoy]

Hmm let me try it another way... Let's consider life one's ability to communicate to the outside world(and yes babies communicate.. they scream don't they? they respond to getting food don't they? Alright then.

[Hamza01]

The man is heroic. I hope he sticks to his guns and isn't pushed into retracting his statements.

[HowlinglyMind-BendingAbsurdity]

I didn't actually intend that sentence with the bit about "dishonest" and "obscurantist" to be understood as meaning your position, if that was the case. I was primarily meaning positions taken by liberals, dissenters, and some journalist. Apologies for any confusion. I'm aware of the valid discussions of celibacy as a church discipline, the history, theory, etc.

[eastsider]

Taking in nutrients and voiding waste products is interracting with that which is "outside" (or "other than") the individual human fetus in the womb

[Cap'n Crunch]

Go get 'em Monsigor! About time somebody started telling it like it is instead of these watered down homilies. We need someone to make a whip of cords and start driving all the monsters out.

[eastsider]

Thanks for the clarification. I'm not particularly taken by the "liberals, dissenters, and some journalists" either.

Till tomorrow, friend.

[Almondjoy]

I can see where we can do this all day.. I'm not a scientist so I won't jump around with definitions... it is myopinion that life doesn't begin if the fetus cannot survive outside the womb during a abortion/birth.. then it isn't a complete functioning human being. And I will say "life" even though you clearly want to fight that word I'll use it anyways only way I can clearly communicate my opinion.. either way you can't argue my definition.. it's pretty concice.

[HowlinglyMind-BendingAbsurdity]

One could add to that that the church's teachings on sexuality face more complicated and difficult cultural and ideological circumstances in contemporary American society than perhaps they once did. Divorce, abortion, promiscuity, teen pregnancy, homosexuality, etc. have undergone transformations in the popular imagination. Things are accepted today which were more frowned upon in the past. (I know these have all existed in some form in the past, etc.). No romantic mysticism implied.

I think it is just valid to point out that about half of all marriages end in something less than bliss in today's sex-obsessed society. The idea that being able to marry ends the sexual psychodrama for most men and women (or for clergy)just doesn't square with the facts. And I think this is one proplem with the hydraulic plumbing theory approach to sex. It's not just about the release of a build up of tension (which seems to be the idea some of the critics of celibacy argue). I know of no adult male that I know socially or personally who goes looking at male teens for that.

[Clint N. Suhks]

hey.. more power to the sheep herders if you know what I'm saying.

Yep, you are just another immoral relativist Liberaltarian I presume.

Are they of age? Meaning over 18?

Of course and in a loving, monogamous, consensual, long term relationship.

But something tells me you’d go for the marriage too, wouldn’t you?

[miss marmelstein]

Msg. Clark was the head of St. Agnes Church in midtown NYC for many, many years (I believe Father Sheen's old parish). He is a fine old priest, very much in the movie tradition of Spencer Tracy & Pat O'Brien. St. Agnes is a wonderfully old-fashioned Catholic Church which serves endless amounts of commuters from Grand Central Station.

[Exnihilo]

Faggots are a great reason to cut funding for AIDS research. Let natural selection work!

[afraidfortherepublic]

I am calling you anti-American because you are advocating mob rule. This is a constituional democratic republic. We are not ruled by mobs, just as we are not ruled by a simple majority. But I really think your thinking is too muddled to profit from an explanation, and I'm signing off now.

Add history to that list of course I recommended.

[tiki]

Go Msgr. Clark! Way to tell the truth.