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To: neocon; top quark; blackElk; berned; romulus
Today Christians and Jews decry the outrageous passages in the Koran. It would do well for us to consider the New Testament, it's connection to anti semitism and it's consequences.

"The children of the kingdom (referring to the Jews) shall be cast out into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth" (Matt 8.12)

"O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets and stonest them that are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not! Behold your house is left unto you desolate" (Matt 23.37,38)

"That upon you (Jews) may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel unto the blood of Zacharias, son of Barachias..." (Matt 23.35)

"Then answered all the people and said, his blood be on us, and on our children" (Matt 27.25).

"But take heed to yourselves: for they shall deliver you to councils, and in the synagogues ye shall be beaten" (Mark 13.9)

"He that believeth not shall be damed" (Mark 16.16)

"Ye are of your father the devil and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar and the father of it. And because I tell you the truth, ye believe me not. which of you convinceth me of sin? And I say the truth, why do you not believe me? He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God" (John 8.43-47)

"Stiff-necked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers did, so you do. Which of the prophets have not your fathers persecuted? and they have slain them which showed before of the coming of the Just One; of whom ye have been now the betrayers and murderers" (Acts 7.51-53)

"It was necessary that the word of God should first have been spoken to you (Jews): but seeing you put it from you and judge yourself unworthy of everlasting life, we turn to the Gentiles" (Acts 13.45-51)

"For there are many unruly and vain talkers and deceivers, specially they of the circumcision: whose mouths must be stopped, who subvert whole houses, teaching things which they ought not, for filthy lucre's sake ... wherefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith; not giving heed to Jewish fables and commandments of men, that turn from the truth". (Titus 1.10-14).

"The Jews, who both killed the Lord Jesus and their own prophets, and have persecuted us; and they please not God and are contrary to all men: forbidding us to speak to the Gentiles that they might be saved, to fill up their sins always: for the wrath is come upon them to the uttermost". (i Thess 2..14-16)

"Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is an antichrist, that denieth the father and the son. Whoever denieth the son, the same hath not the father" (1 John 2.22,23)

These vicious and treacherous New Testament teachings, have given the impression that the Jews in the time of Jesus were degenerate and cruel and that they are a deicide race. They have been spread by the church for the last two millennia, and have not been rooted out of Christian thinking to the present day. Even those Christian lovers of Israel, only love the Jews in order to save them from the punishment awaiting them for not having accepted Jesus.

Remember, many learn all this in their Sunday school classes at young, impressionable ages [5-10 years old] and grow up with it. How can a Christian really like Jews when the anti-Jewish teachings of the Christian Bible are his or her first teachings at such an impressionable young age?

28 posted on 04/20/2002 9:37:23 PM PDT by HockeyPop
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To: HockeyPop
How can a Christian really like Jews when the anti-Jewish teachings of the Christian Bible are his or her first teachings at such an impressionable young age?

I was never taught those things in Sunday School.
And how can you be sure a Christian like me "really" likes you?
I dunno HockeyPop...up until this last post I thought you were a Mensch.

29 posted on 04/20/2002 9:45:22 PM PDT by d4now
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To: neocon; top quark; blackElk; berned; romulus
Let me say that my post above does not advocate collective guilt. That would be like saying white America owes black America reparations for the sins of some who engaged in the slave trade. Just as white Christian soldiers died in our Civil War, so too did they die in North Africa, Normandy and the Ardennes in order to remove nazism from the face of the earth. In fact, there are passages in the Talmud which could be interpreted as anti gentile. There is enough shame and guilt to go around. What makes the Jews plight throughout history so wrought with horror is the fact that they, as a minority, have always been at the mercy of whichever host culture and country they have lived.

Is it any wonder that today Israeli men in their forties have been putting down their tools, picking up their rifles and kissing their wives and kids good bye as they go off to fight for their existence? We owe them our support because theirs rests on a far higher moral ground.

31 posted on 04/20/2002 10:03:50 PM PDT by HockeyPop
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To: HockeyPop
Even those Christian lovers of Israel, only love the Jews in order to save them from the punishment awaiting them for not having accepted Jesus. Also, this sentence is confusing.

If you meant I only love Israel because it a "Christian" thing to do - you're wrong. I love Israel for several reasons. Good, hardworking people who are fighting for their lives against a terrorism I can not fathom - just for starters.

32 posted on 04/20/2002 10:05:35 PM PDT by d4now
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To: HockeyPop
Christianity began as a Jewish sect, and during the first generations, there was fighting between Jews who followed Jesus and those who hated him and his followers. By the turn of the century, Christianity and Judaism had become separate groups, with most Christians now being non-Jewish. Jewish scholarship became anti-christian, both in the sense of minimizing the messianic Scriptures and in opposition to Christian teachings. It became impossible to be both a Jew and a Christian. The hostility between Greeks and Jews, which went back before Christ, did not abate as the Christians drew recruits from among the Greeks. But in the Roman Empire, the Jews had the stronger position legally, since Rome made peace with them after the failure of the Bar Kochka revolt, whereas the Christians remained an outloaw sect, subject to prosecution The Jews were always glad to stir up trouble for the Christians.By the 4th Century Christians outnumbered the Jews, although probably not by much. When Christibaity wss recognized by Constantine, the tables were turned, and the Christians now used political pressure against the Jews. The hatred between the two that was generated during four hundred years unfortunately set the tone for the future. The Jews were persecuted simply because they had become weaker.
37 posted on 04/20/2002 10:19:46 PM PDT by RobbyS
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