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What happened at Jenin - AND - Israel's "war crime"
From The Economist print edition ^ | Apr 18th 2002 | staff

Posted on 04/18/2002 8:14:41 PM PDT by Phil V.

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To: Phil V.
Before I'm accused of being more upset about dead Jewish than dead Muslim kids, let me say that I take people at their own estimation: in the Palestinian Authority schools, they teach their children about the glories of martyrdom; indeed, the careers guidance counsellor appears to have little information on alternative employment prospects; at social events, the moppets are dressed up as junior jihadi, with toy detonators and play bombs.





41 posted on 04/19/2002 2:33:34 AM PDT by MeekOneGOP
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To: Phil V.
A LETTER FROM ISRAEL
http://www.FreeRepublic.com/focus/news/658193/posts
42 posted on 04/19/2002 2:34:10 AM PDT by MeekOneGOP
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To: Phil V.


43 posted on 04/19/2002 2:35:02 AM PDT by MeekOneGOP
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To: Phil V.


Mark Steyn Link
44 posted on 04/19/2002 2:35:13 AM PDT by MeekOneGOP
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To: Phil V.
A bit of collateral damage does not a war crime make.

There isn't a single report of the widespread use of Willie Pete. Darn it!

45 posted on 04/19/2002 4:32:39 AM PDT by neutrino
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To: BrooklynGOP
. . . from the article link in #29

"He is a member of Islamic Jihad, but says in Jenin all the factions were loyal to only one cause: liberation or death."

I've read of other people in other times who uttered similar passion. I hear that it is difficult to quench.

46 posted on 04/19/2002 5:48:45 AM PDT by Phil V.
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To: luvzhottea
I think the blowback from this is going to be terrible.

Only among the mentally and history-challenged.

Most of us realize that an identically sympathetic propaganda picture could be assembled of the Germans picking through the rubble of the remains of their cities after their defeat... or the Japanese... or Pol Pot... or Idi Amin...

47 posted on 04/19/2002 5:57:11 AM PDT by Publius6961
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To: neutrino
"Willie Pete" . . . in the morning?
48 posted on 04/19/2002 5:59:45 AM PDT by Phil V.
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To: Demidog
"We could not leave our homes and the army refused to let any medic, Palestinian or foreign, into the camp for five days. How on earth could we remove them?"

Golly...
Hundreds of Palestinians could leave their homes and fire at the IDF force and set booby traps.

Unless you are prepared to convince us that the IDF force was creating all that intense automatic gunfire and shooting and blowing up themselves.
Yeah. That must be it.

49 posted on 04/19/2002 6:01:38 AM PDT by Publius6961
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To: Phil V., luvzhottea
Ever since Powell came back from the ME Bush has practically been falling over himself to praise Sharon and Israel. He would not be doing that if he thought something bad happened in Jenin. Today Bush defended the Israelis refusal to back down from the terrorists in the Church of the Nativity.
50 posted on 04/19/2002 6:06:44 AM PDT by scratchgolfer
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To: Phil V.
"He is a member of Islamic Jihad, but says in Jenin all the factions were loyal to only one cause: liberation or death." I've read of other people in other times who uttered similar passion.

Bin Laden on "liberation" of Saudi Arabia of infidels? I hear that it is difficult to quench.

Is it? King Hussein had no problems in the events of black september... Then again he used different methods, didn't he... Going to comment on that?

51 posted on 04/19/2002 7:47:35 AM PDT by BrooklynGOP
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To: Phil V.
Oh, right, I forgot how the King of England offered to let the pre-revolutionary Americans govern themselves...
52 posted on 04/19/2002 9:19:26 AM PDT by KayEyeDoubleDee
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To: Publius6961
Hundreds of Palestinians could leave their homes and fire at the IDF force and set booby traps.

LOL.

53 posted on 04/19/2002 9:52:35 AM PDT by Demidog
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To: BrooklynGOP
The events of black september were not triggered by the king's occupation, dispossesion or appropriation of Palestinian property, homes and businesses.
54 posted on 04/19/2002 4:24:01 PM PDT by Phil V.
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To: KayEyeDoubleDee
I forgot how the King of England offered to let the pre-revolutionary Americans govern themselves while at the same time maintaining English Settlements connected by English roads controlled by English checkpoints with virtually all of the infrastructure from water and natural resources controlled by the English.

It was a great deal. I haven't a clue why the founding fathers turned down this generous deal. Instead they broke the "rules of war" and hid behind trees and killed the poor British. Sneaky bastards.

And to think that some hot-head cried, "Give me liberty or give me death".

55 posted on 04/19/2002 4:33:02 PM PDT by Phil V.
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To: Phil V.
The events of black september were not triggered by the king's occupation, dispossesion or appropriation of Palestinian property, homes and businesses.

Really? You need to brush up on your history. When UN introduced the partition plan there were 2 parts... The Jewish part and the Palestinian part. What do you think happened to the palestinian chunk of land after 1948? It was occupied by Jordan. Do you disputre the fact that West Bank was occupied by Jordan prior to 1967? Why do you think Arafat started an intifadah in black september? He wanted to annex a chunk of land.

56 posted on 04/19/2002 7:08:17 PM PDT by BrooklynGOP
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To: Phil V.

57 posted on 04/19/2002 7:11:21 PM PDT by Lady Jag
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To: sciencediet
Funded by ACME?
58 posted on 04/19/2002 8:27:10 PM PDT by Phil V.
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To: BrooklynGOP
ME: "The events of black september were not triggered by the king's occupation, dispossesion or appropriation of Palestinian property, homes and businesses. "

YOU: Really? You need to brush up on your history.


. . . but Israel's military victory over Jordan in the Arab-Israeli War of June 1967 was a severe setback to Hussein's regime, resulting as it did in the loss of the West Bank to Israel and the influx of more Palestinian refugees into Jordan. After the war Hussein's rule was threatened by the military forces of the Palestine Liberation Organization (PLO), who based themselves in Jordan to carry out guerrilla raids against Israel. In September 1970 full-scale warfare broke out between the PLO and Hussein's army in a struggle for control of the country. Hussein's army succeeded in completely expelling the PLO's forces from Jordan in 1971. 
 

In 1969 Yasir ‘Arafat , leader of Fatah, was named the PLO's chairman. From the late 1960s the PLO organized and launched guerrilla attacks against Israel from its bases in Jordan, which prompted significant Israeli reprisals and led to instability within Jordan. This, in turn, brought the PLO into growing conflict with the government of King Hussein of Jordan in 1970, and in 1971 the PLO was forcibly expelled from the country by the Jordanian army. Thereafter the PLO shifted its bases to Lebanon and continued its attacks on Israel. The PLO's relations with the Lebanese were tumultuous, and the organization soon became embroiled in Lebanon's sectarian disputes and contributed to that country's eventual slide into civil war. During that time, factions within the PLO shifted from attacks on military targets to a strategy of terrorism—a policy the organization fervently denied embracing—and a number of high-profile attacks, including bombings and aircraft hijackings, were staged by PLO operatives against Israeli and Western targets. 


Now, after "brushing up on history" I stand on my earlier statement, "The events of black september were not triggered by the king's occupation, dispossesion or appropriation of Palestinian property, homes and businesses. "
59 posted on 04/21/2002 8:08:20 AM PDT by Phil V.
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To: Phil V.
Now, after "brushing up on history" I stand on my earlier statement, "The events of black september were not triggered by the king's occupation, dispossesion or appropriation of Palestinian property, homes and businesses.

Oh really. The fact is that king of Jordan WAS occupying the palestinian lands. Another facts is that By late 1968, the main fedayeen activities in Jordan seemed to shift from fighting Israel to attempts to overthrow Hussein.

Or This is especially relevant because the PLO was not set up by Palestinians living in ISRAEL/PALESTINE, but by Nasser of Egypt in 1964 as a revolutionary commando force against Israel. The PLO later changed its location to Jordan, but in 1972 attempted a coup against King Hussein of Jordan, whose loyal Bedouin (not Palestinian) Army, in what as know as "Black September, 1972" defeated the attempted coup (killing thousands in the process, and driving the PLO out of Jordan, into Lebanon (which naively allowed the PLO entry).

Interestingly. You are implying PLO (created in 1964 - 3 years prior to the 6 day war) was fighting for "liberation" of palestinian lands in Israel, but somehow not in Jordan? Somehow pallies just decided to give up the west bank without a peep? Is this what you allege? That's not consistent with your earlier post that the pursuit for libery is "hard to quench" is it?

60 posted on 04/21/2002 8:52:48 AM PDT by BrooklynGOP
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