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High-profile anti-Unix site runs Unix (Microsoft's Unix Bashing site runs on Unix server)
cnet ^

Posted on 04/01/2002 7:06:49 AM PST by HamiltonJay

High-profile anti-Unix site runs Unix

By

Mike Ricciuti


Staff Writer, CNET News.com

April 1, 2002, 6:10 AM PT


A Web site sponsored by Microsoft and Unisys as a way to steer big companies away from the Unix operating system is itself powered by Unix software.

The site, dubbed "We Have The Way Out," runs on Web servers powered by FreeBSD, an open-source version of Unix, along with the Unix-based Web server Apache, according to Netcraft, which tracks Web site information. Both pieces of software compete with Microsoft's Windows operating system. The Microsoft/Unisys site solicits names and contact information in exchange for research reports on data center trends.

Officials at Unisys and Microsoft weren't immediately available for comment.

The marketing site's use of Unix comes as Microsoft works to get a greater foothold for its Windows operating system in the enterprise computing market, where Unix is well entrenched. Unisys partnered with Microsoft to co-market its large server hardware running Windows as a Unix alternative.

The Web site is just part of Microsoft's renewed marketing and advertising campaign to undermine Unix, the operating system at the heart of powerful server lines from rivals Sun Microsystems, IBM and Hewlett-Packard.

Unisys is spending $25 million on the campaign. Microsoft is adding funding of its own but has declined to say how much.

The "We have the way out" campaign describes Unix as an expensive trap. "No wonder Unix makes you feel boxed in. It ties you to an inflexible system. It requires you to pay for expensive experts. It makes you struggle daily with a server environment that's more complex than ever," one ad reads.

The same ad depicts a scene in which a computer user has painted himself into a corner with purple paint. Sun's servers are manufactured in a shade of purple similar to that in the ad.

The 18-month project will include advertisements, technical sales efforts and other marketing work plugging Unisys' high-end server and Microsoft's top-end version of Windows--two products that so far have made only their first steps into the data centers where high-end servers often reside.

The Unisys ES7000 server can accommodate as many as 32 Intel processors and can be divided into independent "partitions," each with its own operating system. The Datacenter version of Windows 2000 can run on machines with as many as 32 processors. These top-end configurations are rare, Unisys has said, with eight-, 12- or 16-processor partitions more common.




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To: Revolting cat!
Any experimentation in the evolution field necessarily means a designer of the experiment, thus showing that ID was absolutely needed for the experiment to succeed.

Get a Dvorak keyboard and announce it to the world?
21 posted on 04/01/2002 7:55:37 AM PST by Dimensio
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To: 4ConservativeJustices
"testing", as in "Host Interation Server" testing, perhaps? For those that bash Microsoft, but don't have a clue as to what products Microsoft produces, HIS is a legacy system integration product connecting Micosoft server systems to legacy mainframe and minicomputer systems, and an AS/400 is a legacy system.
22 posted on 04/01/2002 7:56:05 AM PST by PatrioticAmerican
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To: Revolting cat!
There are keyboard patches aplenty to convert QWERTY to DVORAK.

Download, implement, and then feel free to express in print your dislike for the old standard.

23 posted on 04/01/2002 7:57:34 AM PST by Mr. Thorne
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To: mattdono
. Do you think you could use a different metaphor? The dog food thing is just gross.

I use this metaphor for a reason. This metaphor is probably the single greatest one there is in software development in my oppinion. Great engineers/developers are groomed by "eating their own dog food" (having to work/use day to day on the products they produce) Only through such behaviors does the attitude of "its good enough" ever get squelched. If a developer/engineer is not forced to use the products he builds the product will not be the best it can and the developer/engineer will not improve their ability and learn from their mistakes.

24 posted on 04/01/2002 7:59:57 AM PST by HamiltonJay
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To: PatrioticAmerican
More rumours, buddy. "forced"? You don't know what you are talking about. How about some sources on the Borland thing and that "forced" statement. For Hotmail, Microsoft bought the company, which was using UNIX at the time. You are trying to make it sound like Microsoft built Hotmail using UNIX, not having purchased a company that built Hotmail using UNIX. I also doubt that you have been so much as a foot inside a Microsoft building, much less a Microsoft data center.

Do you even read my posts? First of all, I very clearly stated "AFTER MICROSOFT ACQUIRED HOTMAIL"... what part of that makes it sound like MS built Hotmail? Secondly, the MS Borland debacle is part of history, not imagination, it made it to the public and is not rumor. Thirdly, What you doubt and what is, it of little consequence to me, there are still those that doubt the earth is round, and I suspect you may be one of them. Facts are I have been to MS, in fact they spent what I consider a reasonable amount of old Bill's money when I was out there being wooed by them. Put me up in a very nice place overlooking the lake, was a very fun time.

25 posted on 04/01/2002 8:04:35 AM PST by HamiltonJay
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To: HamiltonJay
Bwa ha ha ha ha ha!
26 posted on 04/01/2002 8:06:23 AM PST by Petronski
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To: HamiltonJay
Yeah, ok.

So, are you saying that MS developers don't run NT/2000/XP Pro on their workstations, don't write documents with Word, spreadsheets with Excel, and use Mozilla in lieu of IE?

Probably not. That was my point about Unisys operating the web site, not Microsoft. You (or the article) implied that Microsoft was operating the web site.

I am not trying to split hairs, but you can't dismiss the facts that Gorons pointed out. Further, if Unisys created and operated the site, it is Unisys that isn't eating its own dog food.

Yuck...I understand your point about developer's behavior, but the dog food thing is still gross.

27 posted on 04/01/2002 8:06:59 AM PST by mattdono
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To: HamiltonJay
I've known a few individual UNIX haters who are nevertheless forced by circumstances to use EUNUCHS. And it's not that they are Wintel or Macjobs boosters. Considering the promises, visions and predictions that were made in this area in the late 1970s and early 1980s, all these operating systems (Mac perhaps less than others,) are flawed, inadequate, incomprehensible, user unfriendly and a bunch of other unkind things.

I have a college textbook published in 1985 or 6 which surveys the operating systems then known and after an intruduction and description of UNIX it says this apologetically (quoting from mem'ry): "You may think that UNIX is a tinker toy operating system." This in a book which also covers MS DOS and CP/M as I recall.

I happen to remember the promise and have trouble becoming fanatically devoted to any of them.

28 posted on 04/01/2002 8:10:24 AM PST by Revolting cat!
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To: PatrioticAmerican, Gorons
I understand the server is hosted by Unisys, and I also know why it likely is not an MS box, but won't start that religious debate. The facts are though that MS and Unisys decided they were going to launch a 20+MM campain to jointly convince people they don't need Unix servers... yet both companies validate in their choice of hardware exactly why their clients do need Unix servers. If MS is so more open, cheap, affordable maintainable, simple it should not have been any issues for Unisys to deploy this site on MS (after all this is a strategic marketing campaign, likely in the works for months, not some skunkwork thrown up in days), and quite frankly I am suprised the MS sales and marketing group did not insist on that fact before they decided to get in bed with Unisys on this.

If you are going to try to convince people they don't need Unix in the server environment and then you don't even follow through on your own servers you certainly don't "have the way out" as they are claiming.

29 posted on 04/01/2002 8:10:34 AM PST by HamiltonJay
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To: Revolting cat!
Change your driver software and any Qwerty keyboard miraculously becomes Dvorak.
30 posted on 04/01/2002 8:11:51 AM PST by HamiltonJay
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To: 4ConservativeJustices
It's wasn't a rumour. Dr. Frank Soltis (IBM engineer) announced [blah blah about MS ] Of course MS denies this, they claim that the machines are used for test purposes.

That sounds like the definition of a rumor.

31 posted on 04/01/2002 8:11:51 AM PST by Grit
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To: HamiltonJay
Thank you. You worded that nicely. As an employee and shareholder, this situation is definitely a red face scenario. What can I say? haha...

Netcraft has caught AOL running websites with IIS, even though they have their own *nix web server.
32 posted on 04/01/2002 8:13:55 AM PST by Gorons
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To: PatrioticAmerican
I wasn't bashing MS - the computers serve a different niche. And anyone that has ever been around the AS/400 knows it's an awesome machine - multiple partitions, multiple OS's at different versions and memory/disk allocations, native web servers, multiple NT Servers running inside, green screen and GUI interfaces, multiple Linux partitions, e-mail server, extremely scalable from briefcase sized portatble to mainframe - all running the same OS/400 operating system.
33 posted on 04/01/2002 8:14:16 AM PST by 4CJ
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To: mattdono
I never dismissed anyones point about Unisys being the hoster. I pointed out that Unisys and MS jointly launched this marketing campaign to convince people they don't need Unix... yet at the end of the day deployed their site on Unix servers. While the machine is hosted and likely owned by Unisys, it is part of a joint marketing initiative with MS and Unisys, and therefor was developed, designed and approved by Unisys and MS! Attempting to say just because its in a Unisys DC leaves MS's hands clean it nonsense.

Personally I can't believe the MS business people did not insist that the server be MS if their name was going to be on it, since they tend to try to force MS OS into everything they can get their hands in. However the point still remains, MS and Unisys decided to convice the world they don't need UNIX in the SERVER environment, and then jointly went with a Unix solution for their SERVER to do this.... if Unisys/MS is going to try to convince the world they "have a way out" of Unix in the server world, they should have made damned well sure the server they are using to promote it displays their ability... this one doesn't.

34 posted on 04/01/2002 8:16:45 AM PST by HamiltonJay
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To: 4ConservativeJustices
Wanna know a killer app for the PC?

At Microsoft we use this product alot to setup testing scenarios without have to have 10 PCs in my cubicle, we load up this on some beefy workstations running XP and 2 gigs of RAM.

http://www.vmware.com/

This product rules!
35 posted on 04/01/2002 8:21:36 AM PST by Gorons
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Comment #36 Removed by Moderator

To: Grit
They did buy them - that's not denied - they just don't admit that they run their company on them (mission critical). I've Dr. Soltis before - and certainly wouldn't think that IBM would allow such comments to be delivered by him without some substantiation.

I wouldn't buy a greyhound to pull a plow, nor would I buy a mule to chase rabbits. They each have their own niche.

37 posted on 04/01/2002 8:24:16 AM PST by 4CJ
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To: toddhisattva
Todd,

Preaching to the chior on this one. Gates has been salivating for the server market for a long while and MS just can't get over the hump, for a multitude of reasons. So they have their Unix bashing in full swing in their latest attempts to gain or retain market share... but when push comes to shove and you look under the hood, MS products, especially OS, in the server realm don't measure up.

38 posted on 04/01/2002 8:27:28 AM PST by HamiltonJay
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To: Gorons
Thanks for the link - I'll have to check it out.
39 posted on 04/01/2002 8:29:38 AM PST by 4CJ
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To: Gorons
Virtual Machines through smaller node clustering is unquestionably the wave of the future of heavy computing. Lycos was able to replace Dec Alpha 8400s with 10 Intel boxes clustered running Linux. Cost differential of several million for the Alpha's to $20000 for the Linux boxes, and this was back in 98/99.
40 posted on 04/01/2002 8:31:55 AM PST by HamiltonJay
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