[hobbes1]

And As I pointed out, that is not quite correct. Aristotle, for all his wisdom had never observed this grand expirement in self governance. There is no Solace, in losing Nobly, because the cause you believe in, also loses.

In American Politics more than any other, winning, is the important thing, because without it winning, and doing what it takes to get there, you would have a government like Clintons First two years, only worse.

[Carry_Okie]

Aristotle, for all his wisdom had never observed this grand expirement in self governance.

Athens?

He had seen plenty of democracy and that is where you are going. You would have us end up BEING the Clintons.

No thank you. Fascism is no fix for democracy.