Posted on 03/21/2002 3:18:59 AM PST by chance33_98
Hogwash. He can't just "conduct his services elsewhere." It takes money. Money to buy property. Money to build. The first ammendment is guaranteed. If the zoning law is causing him not to be able to practice his religion, it is wrong.
As for the scale of people attending.. that is another issue. Safety, and other considerations would limit this concern... NOT ZONING. There is no case of zoning laws prior to the 20th century. Additionally, churches have always been in residential areas.
It used to be that a church was looked upon as a positive addition to a neighborhood, or section of town. With the new anti-God, anti-religion climate in this country, this is no longer the case.
Either we own our land or we don't. I gurantee you he could hold a drunken football party or bluehaired bridge club with the same amount of attendees every week and the county wouldn't say squat. I've seen it happen. I personally know a pastor that was told by the County he could NOT hold regularly scheduled prayer meetings in his home for 15-30 people. He was told he could meet for any other reason except religious, as it then became a "church".
I live in Florida (Indian River County). My view is as long as they are not on my property or making too much noise, etc. Then it is nobody's business what they do. It is HIS property.
I'm sick to death of these zoning NAZI's. They never can leave it at good common sense. They always go too far. The deed restriction wannabes can jump in the same lake.
Here's to the Florida I was born and raised in, and I hope the Jew wins...
- a 6th generation Cracker
Chicago Public Schools set up Muslim Prayer Rooms
Chicago Schools Create Prayer Room for Muslims
SCHOOL PRAYER IS FINE - AS LONG AS YOU'RE MUSLIM, New York Schools.
Rock Bridge accommodates Muslim students: "It sounds like we set up a mosque in our (public) school", Columbia, Missouri
I wonder that Muslims or those otherwise accomodated ever understand the backhanded nature of the compliment ... the war on Christianity being part and parcel of its Proof.
That pretty well sums up my attitude on this issue as well, but this situation is different. The visitors have been parking on neighbors' lawns, sometimes damaging property in the process, and causing traffic and parking problems. This is a residential area, and if you live there, you don't expect these kind of problems on an ongoing basis (as many as ten times a week).
When I first read the article at the top of this thread, I was sympathetic to the rabbi, and thought the zoning board was wrong, but after doing some more research and finding the article that I linked to, I changed my mind.
"All we wanted to do is share my Saturday meals with friends," Konikov said.
The rabbi is misrepresenting his case. Here are some more quotes from the article:
As part of the county’s case against Konikov, Glassman cited three Web sites where Konikov has listed his home as a place of worship open to anyone interested in praying
“It’s not just small, occasional gatherings,” said Ted McDonald, who lives a few doors down from Konikov and is president of the Sand Lake Hills Homeowners Association. He said the rabbi sometimes hosts nearly a dozen meetings a week. On Wednesday, McDonald presented a petition with roughly 300 signatures of people opposed to Konikov’s violation of the county code.
“I think he’s making a big mistake,” Lunin said. It’s not about Jewish discrimination or even government discrimination against religions in general, he said. “It may well be an issue about people not liking traffic in their quiet neighborhoods, about people worrying about their kids having to dodge too much traffic,” Lunin said.
I don't care what he does on his own property and I don't think zoning laws should address that, but this is causing a serious impact on his neighbors that I think needs to be dealt with.
If you don' t mind, that's your prerogative, but the county had a petition with 300 signatures to deal with from the rabbi's neighbors. The fact that they decided to take some action to deal with that does not make them "jack booted thugs" by any stretch of the imagination.
Yes, let's also deal with the traffic and parking issue. How many cars are needed to transport these folks? Conservatively, you're adding at least 20 cars to the neighborhood for the duration of this gathering. What about the rights of the other homeowners/taxpayers?
I'll check back after I've taken the time to read the article. But it's going to take a lot of evidence to convince me otherwise. I'm all for freedom of religion, but why not build your own church?
Don't miss the link I posted in #29.
Thanks for the support. I was beginning to feel like the Lone Ranger on this thread.
I knew we weren't getting the 'Rest of the Story'. Here, for the benefit of all, are quotes from the Sentinel article:
Neighbors and enforcement-board investigators say members of the synagogue came by the dozens, parking on lawns and curbs and creating traffic jams.
Pittman said the case rose beyond the tolerable. “You can have friends over to watch Monday Night Football,” he said, referring to the analogy often repeated by Konikov and his supporters. “But if you have people coming over three or four times a week with lots of cars and traffic problems, and neighbors complain, then you have a problem.”
As a testament to how popular Konikov’s Tamarind Circle home had become, the county counted 373 vehicles and 510 people descending on the rabbi’s house for worship, study or fellowship during a period of 49 days.
“It’s not just small, occasional gatherings,” said Ted McDonald, who lives a few doors down from Konikov and is president of the Sand Lake Hills Homeowners Association. He said the rabbi sometimes hosts nearly a dozen meetings a week.
The rabbi never directly challenged neighbors’ accusations about parking and traffic. He and his attorney focused their comments on the larger constitutional question of freedom of religion.
Sorry, folks. What this rabbi needs to do is raise the funds for a synogogue. This has been going on for over a year. It's time for the rabbi to move his congregation to a more appropriate site.
The parish that I belong to (St. Ann Catholic Parish, Coppell, TX) started much the same way about 15 years ago. It started with a modest number of families, and has since grown to over 5,000 families. Last October, our new church was dedicated, and has a seating capacity of approximately 1500 worshipers. When we aren't early for the 10 AM or noon Mass on Sunday, it's SRO.
I only bring this up to buttress my point that I don't think this is an issue of freedom of religion. The rights of the residents to live in peace and quiet are also worthy of respect. How would you like it if numerous cars were parked in front of your house/street several days a week? I'm sure these are good people, but they really need to establish a more appropriate place of worship. The good rabbi might find that his flock would increase exponentially!
I guess I'll have to start calling you Tonto now!
Freegards.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.