[Mark Bahner]

Because he proselytized for the Unitarian Church at the time there was a huge debate, won by Daniel Webster (a Unitarian himself), over the church being funded in Massachusetts and elsewhere by state taxes.

Well, you're wrong. The Virginia Religious Freedom statute, of which Jefferson was the original author (though it was actually passed through the efforts of Madison) makes it very clear that Jefferson did NOT support Virginia state taxes being paid to churches. He called that "sinful and tyrannical, in fact."

So you'll have to come up with more evidence than that Jefferson "proselytized for the Unitarian Church" as proof that he supported having Virginia tax monies paid to the Unitarian Church. (Such monies would have actually been illegal in Virginia, precisely because of the Religious Freedom Statute of which Jefferson was so justifiably proud.)

I'm going to be off the FR boards for a couple of days, but I look forward to any quote you might find that overcomes my Jefferson quote that such taxes would be "sinful and tyrannical."

[LarryLied]

There were not any Unitarian churchs anywhere near where Jefferson lived. But he did know all the prominent "dissenters" of the day, including Channing. Jefferson made his famous statement about wanting everyone in the USA to "die a Unitarian" while the debate over prohibiting Massachusetts from levying state taxes to fund the Unitarian and Congregationalist churches was at a peak. If Jefferson was so opposed to taxes supporting religion, why was he a member of a church whose leaders endorsed the concept? Be aware that Jefferson held many conflicting opinions during his life. His views on Unitarianism and its role in soceity, however, reached fruition in his final days.

[OrthodoxPresbyterian]

Well, you're wrong. The Virginia Religious Freedom statute, of which Jefferson was the original author (though it was actually passed through the efforts of Madison) makes it very clear that Jefferson did NOT support Virginia state taxes being paid to churches. He called that "sinful and tyrannical, in fact." So you'll have to come up with more evidence than that Jefferson "proselytized for the Unitarian Church" as proof that he supported having Virginia tax monies paid to the Unitarian Church. (Such monies would have actually been illegal in Virginia, precisely because of the Religious Freedom Statute of which Jefferson was so justifiably proud.) I'm going to be off the FR boards for a couple of days, but I look forward to any quote you might find that overcomes my Jefferson quote that such taxes would be "sinful and tyrannical." 77 posted on 3/17/02 8:36 PM Pacific by Mark Bahner

You say you are a Calvinist. I am not. I am of a sect by myself, as far as I know.
-Thomas Jefferson, letter to Ezra Stiles Ely, June 25, 1819

Jefferson was no Calvinist (Jefferson knew of Calvinism, and quite expressly did not claim to be one); and Jefferson was no Unitarian (Jefferson knew of Unitarianism, and quite expressly did not claim to be one).

It is inappropriate for any organized system of religious doctrine to claim Jefferson as their own; Jefferson's greatest Moral sin was, perhaps, Hubris.... Spiritual Pride. Being a Great Man (and he surely was), he considered himself more-or-less competent to make up his own religion as he went through life. Neither Calvinist nor Unitarian, Jefferson was a Sect unto himself.

I don't consider such Spiritual Pride a particularly good way for Man to make his way to God, but it certainly disallows the ridiculous idea that Jefferson "proselytized for the Unitarians" any more than Jefferson "proselytized for the Calvinists". Jefferson did neither. He claimed no Calvinism and He claimed no Unitarianism; he made up his own idea of Religion, and there, but for the grace of God, go we all.