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To: justme346
Seize them and slay them wherever you find them: and in any case take no friends or helpers from their ranks." - Surah 4:89
Medina Suras
The Chapter of Women
[Chapters from the Koran]
The Harvard Classics 1909–14

But if there befalls you grace from God, he would say—as though there were no friendship between you and him—‘O would that I had been with thee to attain this mighty happiness!’ Let those then fight in God’s way who sell this life of the world for the next; and whoso fights in God’s way, then, be he killed or be he victorious, we will give him a mighty hire.

What ails you that ye do not fight in God’s way, and for the weak men and women and children, who say, ‘Lord, bring us out of this town 19 of oppressive folk, and make for us from Thee a patron, and make for us from Thee a help?’

Those who believe fight in the way of God; and those who disbelieve fight in the way of Tâghût; fight ye then against the friends of Satan, verily, Satan’s tricks are weak.

Do ye not see those to whom it is said, ‘Restrain your hands, and be steadfast in prayer and give alms;’ and when it is prescribed for them to fight then a band of them fear men, as though it were the fear of God or a still stronger fear, and they say, ‘O our Lord! why hast thou prescribed for us to fight, couldst thou not let us abide till our near appointed time?’ Say, ‘The enjoyment of this world is but slight, and the next is better for him who fears;’—but they shall not be wronged a straw.

...

Why are ye two parties about the hypocrites, when God hath overturned them for what they earned? Do ye wish to guide those whom God hath led astray? Whoso God hath led astray ye shall not surely find for him a path. They would fain that ye misbelieve as they misbelieve, that ye might be alike; take ye not patrons from among them until they too flee in God’s way; but if they turn their backs, then seize them and kill them wheresoever ye find them, and take from them neither patron nor help,—save those who reach a people betwixt whom and you is an alliance—or who come to you while their bosoms prevent them from fighting you or fighting their own people. But had God pleased He would have given you dominion over them, and they would surely have fought you. But if they retire from you and do not fight you, and offer you peace,—then God hath given you no way against them.

Ye will find others who seek for quarter from you, and quarter from their own people; whenever they return to sedition they shall be overturned therein: but if they retire not from you, nor offer you peace, nor restrain their hands, then seize them and kill them wheresoever ye find them;—over these we have made for you manifest power.


4 posted on 03/11/2002 12:45:58 PM PST by SlickWillard
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To: SlickWillard
You cited the Koran: "then seize them and kill them wheresoever ye find them, and take from them neither patron nor help,—save those who reach a people betwixt whom and you is an alliance—or who come to you while their bosoms prevent them from fighting you or fighting their own people. ... But if they retire from you and do not fight you, and offer you peace,—then God hath given you no way against them." Good post, for you have done the obvious thing in citing the Koran at length. Thus we see the statement in context. But really, is it not qualified? If the enemy "retires" or is weak, or offers terms, then "God hath given you no way against them." Also there is the warning not to exceed the limits, for Allah loves not those who exceed limits (in warfare.) This is in a different part of the book. It seems to me that this is heretical, from the Christian point of view, not because it is too warlike, but because it is too weak. We are told, in the Book of Numbers, to slay them all - even the male children - save the girls who have not known man. The massacres in the Book of Joshua are proverbial.
18 posted on 03/11/2002 4:34:21 PM PST by BlackVeil
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